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What are your preferences for the Lakers' rebuild?


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Poll: What are your preferences for the Lakers' rebuild? (29 member(s) have cast votes)

What is your rebuild preference among the options below?

  1. Randle, Ingram, Ball, Kuzma, Hart, no Free Agent signings this year (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  2. Ingram, Ball, Kuzma, Hart, no Free Agent signings this year (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  3. Randle, Ingram, Ball, Kuzma, Hart + Paul George (12 votes [41.38%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 41.38%

  4. Ingram, Ball, Kuzma, Hart + Paul George (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  5. Randle, Ingram, Ball, Kuzma, Hart + Paul George + Lebron James (11 votes [37.93%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 37.93%

  6. Ingram, Ball, Kuzma, Hart + Paul George + Lebron James (1 votes [3.45%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 3.45%

  7. Randle, Ingram, Ball, Kuzma, Hart + Paul George + DeAndre Jordan (2 votes [6.90%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 6.90%

  8. Ingram, Ball, Kuzma, Hart + Paul George + DeAndre Jordan (2 votes [6.90%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 6.90%

  9. Other (Please specify in thread) (1 votes [3.45%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 3.45%

Would you want to see Lebron James in Lakers uniform?

  1. Yes (11 votes [37.93%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 37.93%

  2. No (7 votes [24.14%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 24.14%

  3. Only under certain conditions (11 votes [37.93%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 37.93%

What is the likelihood that Paul George will wear the Lakers jersey next year?

  1. Most definitely (4 votes [13.79%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 13.79%

  2. Good possibility (21 votes [72.41%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 72.41%

  3. Slim chance (3 votes [10.34%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 10.34%

  4. No way (1 votes [3.45%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 3.45%

What is the likelihood that Lakers will be a contender in next 2 seasons?

  1. Most definitely (4 votes [13.79%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 13.79%

  2. Good possibility (17 votes [58.62%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 58.62%

  3. Slim chance (8 votes [27.59%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 27.59%

  4. No way (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

Would you consider trading one of the core players (Ingram, Ball, Kuzma) in order to lure a star/superstar?

  1. No (18 votes [62.07%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 62.07%

  2. Only Ingram (2 votes [6.90%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 6.90%

  3. Only Ball (2 votes [6.90%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 6.90%

  4. Only Kuzma (2 votes [6.90%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 6.90%

  5. I would consider trading multiple of them (5 votes [17.24%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 17.24%

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#21 BasketballIQ

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Posted February 12, 2018 - 01:51 PM

LeBron's D has been terrible this season, it's like he doesn't even care. Reminds me a lot of Kobe's final years.



And Cavs were worst D in the league.

#22 BasketballIQ

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Posted February 12, 2018 - 02:00 PM

Leabrin being the best poward forward offensively is wrong. Best defensively is just dumb
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#23 GCMD

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Posted February 12, 2018 - 02:02 PM

Agree to disagree.  You have a right to your opinion.


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#24 BasketballIQ

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Posted February 12, 2018 - 04:04 PM

Eye test is opinion. Stats are part of the picture.

#25 GCMD

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Posted February 12, 2018 - 04:46 PM

Eye test is opinion. Stats are part of the picture.

 

 

Not sure anyone ever disputed these terms.  I'm not saying I agree with your definitions because I think you've left a lot out.

 

Agree to disagree.  Have a nice day.


Edited by GCMD, February 12, 2018 - 04:46 PM.

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#26 Saber

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Posted February 12, 2018 - 07:15 PM

I think that this feeling you guys are having is based on the fear that Bron will somehow surpass Kobe in Laker history. Which makes very little sense.

 

I don't think there's even a single person who honestly thinks Lebron can surpass Kobe in Laker history. Even if he ends up with us, all the stars line up and we miraculously win 2-3 chips with Bron at the helm it still won't be enough to even consider Lebron somehow replacing Kobe at the Lakers pantheon.



#27 GCMD

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Posted February 12, 2018 - 09:05 PM

I don't think there's even a single person who honestly thinks Lebron can surpass Kobe in Laker history. Even if he ends up with us, all the stars line up and we miraculously win 2-3 chips with Bron at the helm it still won't be enough to even consider Lebron somehow replacing Kobe at the Lakers pantheon.

 

 

I don't think Kid was arguing that point.  I think he was presenting the argument as the reason some didn't want LeBron...to even give LeBron a CHANCE at winning here seems like a betrayal of Kobe to some.


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#28 Tensai

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Posted February 12, 2018 - 11:51 PM

I will give my thoughts on this whole ordeal, falling into trap that I will repeat my stand on this matter but let that be my fault.

 

Laker fans, and the people who have been managing this franchise had a trauma when Kobe torn his Achilles, and in a matter of months Dwight left. We need to understand this trauma if we want to provide an insight into Lakers affairs.

 

When Kobe ruptured his Achilles tendon after having possibly his best offensive year since 2006, everyone was in shock. Nobody could believe that the legend of Kobe could actually come to an end, after all he and his Lakers overcame every obstacle (from Shaq's departure to first round exits against Phoenix to an embarrasing Finals loss against Celtics to numerous injuries). There was fear, but there was also a denial. The denial that Lakers as we came to know would also overcome such an infamous injury. Kobe's initial thoughts were along those lines.

 

When Dwight left in the summer of 2013 saying that he wanted to be the man on his own team, the fans were enraged. Among those fans there were those who loved Kobe in particular, but there were also those who thought Kobe should have passed the torch to Dwight and it was Kobe's fault that Dwight left. Both of these stances were the product of one thing only: Kobe's injury. The fear and denial that was created by Kobe's injury created a whirlpool that pushed the sides to opposite ends of the same spectrum. The fans accused each other for 'not being the real fan'. However, that was far from the truth. Moving on, the front office decided to give Kobe an extension for the premise that the late Buss would have done the same thing, i.e. take care of Kobe for every thing he has done for the franchise. We can argue that it was right or wrong, but that shouldn't be the focus. The front office gave a decision based on what they believed that should have been done and that was it. One decision does not change the course of the franchise. But the failure to assess the situation they are in does affect their fate, and that is what happened afterwards that sank the Lakers to bottom of irrelevancy.

 

The denial that Lakers could not possibly become a team that does not make the playoffs annually was the starting point that it all came to fail. The Lakers were just like any other team, and if they fail to perform consistently on the floor, just like every other team they could also lose games. But the franchise did not understand this. After the first year of failure, the trauma deepened. When we saw that Kobe was not his former self, we wanted to replace him. Not in our hearts, but by bargaining that we could find another Kobe to lead the team. And thus began our obsession to pursue superstars in free agency. You could find all sorts of justifications by the pundits that Lakers could only succeed by luring a superstar or by draft. They wrote the alure of Los Angeles to ends, and painted the minds of people with rose color directly addressing their fears and denials. The front office could not see this. And they pursued Carmelo Anthony, Lebron James, LaMarcus Aldridge and all other big names. In the course of such holy search, they also snubbed players like Isaiah Thomas because they thought there was no way Isaiah Thomas could replace Kobe. He was just a player that was drafted from the last place in draft.

 

For years, the players came and left. From Hibbert to Boozer to Mozgov to Deng to Young to Lopez to KCP... you know. The obsession to bring a superstar and denial of the Lakers' situation cost the Lakers 5 painful years. And they were painful especially because there was denial, and especially because it was mismanaged. Now, we need to look at this Lebron thing in same light. I could understand why people would want to watch a skillful player like Lebron James in Staples Center. After all, they were spoiled by Kobe for years. However, again we are missing same thing. We are missing what is really important. If the aim is to field a competitive team on the floor, the answer isn't just restricted to superstar names. And second, if the front office is going to propagate this team further, then the moves they make become relevant. The front office, Magic and Pelinka, must consider the Lakers values when they make a move.

 

Lebron James, in particular, is famous/infamous for everything he does, because he is successful and because he has a certain character. From his early years where he emulated Jordan's persona, to The Decision, to coming back to Cleveland again to Now, there is one theme consistent with Lebron, i.e., he is very pragmatic when he comes to his affairs. Some would call that selfish, some would call that freedom, I choose to call it pragmatism. Lebron's way of finding practical solutions in search of success has led him to meddle with affairs he wasn't supposed to. The first thing that comes to mind is how vocal he has been for the player pool he's been part of, on the coach, on his GM or the owner of the team. When he left Cleveland in 2010, everybody was aware that things weren't right. The owner and Lebron had not been talking for months, and it was speculated that Lebron didn't like to play for Mike Brown. Lebron of course had a right to choose his own destiny and he left on his own terms to team up with his friends in Miami. So far, OK. But the fashion it's been done from the moment the parade was thrown to celebrate the 're-union' of 2003 class, to Lebron and Wade openly mocking Dirk in 2011 Finals left a bad taste in people's mouths. It was very un-gentleman. In the following 3 years the Heat became successful (in my opinion) and done what they were destined to accomplish: Win multiple championships. From that point on, we have seen Lebron's pragmatic nature again when he left Miami and returned to play for the owner that accused him of betrayal for the premise that he could lead a young promising core to title.

 

Things have happened since Lebron's return to Cleveland but one thing has not changed: Things happen to satisfy Lebron's pragmatic nature. From the pletoria of free agent signings, to trades, to moves that wants to maximize Lebron's chances to win a title, there is no constant but Lebron. And that Lebron knowing that he can always maximizes his chances elsewhere never commits. And what we are left with is a scenery with no loyalty, no values and spineless actions and comments from both sides. LA has drama, but I don't think there has ever been an immoral story such as the one we are witnessing around Lebron's career. That is why some fans do not want Lebron. He represents the exact opposite of the values Lakers care. Loyalty, passion, fans are important for Lakers. The Lakers and Jerry Buss could have been as practical in any moment of the history. But they never were. Sure, Jerry Buss wanted to build a competitive team and wanted to leave a legacy behind but he did it his own way. And we want to respect and hold that standard to modern Lakers too. And there is nothing wrong with that.


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#29 DaSmoothOperator

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Posted February 13, 2018 - 12:33 AM

If you know your teams not good enough you mail it in.

#30 LACAS

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Posted February 13, 2018 - 06:11 AM

Tensai, cliff notes?


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#31 BasketballIQ

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Posted February 13, 2018 - 11:25 AM

Kobe tore his Achilles fufilling a promise to Dr Buss who passed.
Bron is a [expletive].


Besides that ... the espn coverage... the signings that follow.

Im coolon him

#32 Massacre

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Posted February 13, 2018 - 02:10 PM

Man, nobody with a brain thinks LeBron can surpass Kobe in Lakers history. That’s stupid.
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#33 Massacre

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Posted February 13, 2018 - 02:18 PM

Y’all are so weirdly obsessed with winning by any means necessary that you don’t consider the cons. LeBron is an all-timer and the best in the game, but we just witnessed first-hand the [expletive] show that was occurring in Cleveland.

The same people who want LeBron are the same people who don’t think we can beat Golden State with him, so are you prepared for the drama when we lose? Because we know the expectation is to win and anything short of that is going to cause chaos. We know damn well LeBron is only signing 1 + 1 deals as a way of holding the franchise hostage and using all the leverage he can with potential roster moves. Check out these JR and TT deals he advocated for, which were okay in hindsight but are now approaching Deng levels of movability.

There’s legit concerns and I’m not even sure a roster with LeBron and PG can beat Golden State, so why deal with all that drama for anything less than a sure thing? You’d have to move Ingram or Kuzma for a Kevin Love/Chris Bosh caliber player (or hope he becomes one) just to be in the conversation.

I get that we’re all Laker fans and we’re used to winning, but the process to getting back to that level has changed. No Kobe. No Magic. What’s the solution? Y’all want to go buy our own version or Kobe and Magic in LeBron? Lol. This is how the league works now...sit back and watch the young kids grow and hope we can get PG this summer. If not, this team will continue developing and maintaining cap flexibility that gives us legit options by the time Golden State is beginning to look mortal.
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#34 LACAS

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Posted February 13, 2018 - 02:45 PM

I get that we’re all Laker fans and we’re used to winning, but the process to getting back to that level has changed. No Kobe. No Magic. What’s the solution? Y’all want to go buy our own version or Kobe and Magic in LeBron? Lol. This is how the league works now...sit back and watch the young kids grow and hope we can get PG this summer. If not, this team will continue developing and maintaining cap flexibility that gives us legit options by the time Golden State is beginning to look mortal.

 

Yup.



#35 KidRN

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Posted February 13, 2018 - 03:57 PM

Y’all are so weirdly obsessed with winning by any means necessary that you don’t consider the cons. LeBron is an all-timer and the best in the game, but we just witnessed first-hand the [expletive] show that was occurring in Cleveland.

The same people who want LeBron are the same people who don’t think we can beat Golden State with him, so are you prepared for the drama when we lose? Because we know the expectation is to win and anything short of that is going to cause chaos. We know damn well LeBron is only signing 1 + 1 deals as a way of holding the franchise hostage and using all the leverage he can with potential roster moves. Check out these JR and TT deals he advocated for, which were okay in hindsight but are now approaching Deng levels of movability.
 

 

The point of a sport is entertainment. Losing isn't entertaining. The Lakers franchise will make more money from winning. Whether you like it or not, Lebron will be offered a max contract this off-season. This isn't my decision or anybody on this forums decision. This will 100% happen as long as Lebron entertains leaving Cleveland.

 

 

There’s legit concerns and I’m not even sure a roster with LeBron and PG can beat Golden State, so why deal with all that drama for anything less than a sure thing? You’d have to move Ingram or Kuzma for a Kevin Love/Chris Bosh caliber player (or hope he becomes one) just to be in the conversation.

 

I 100% agree. I have been saying this for some time now. Most people on this forum have some unrealistic view of this off-season and believe that Bron will come here while keeping all of our youth intact. That isn't happening lol. Somebody will be moved and once they are, we will be a threat to GS. I am perfectly fine with shipping out Ingram and that 1st round pick for a player of the caliber that you just mentioned. This gives us the ability to contend for a couple of years while Ball and Kuzma develop. What exactly is the problem? We don't need 5 guys all developing at the same time. We have the rare combination of cap space and trade assets that allows us to keep some youth for the future while bringing in players to contend. Lebron will likely have Ingram and maybe Kuzma both shipped out depending on what we can get in return. Both of those guys in a package for Anthony Davis? Sign me right up for that. He is still young enough to be a part of our future. Ball, AD, and Hart going forward is enough! I'm not sure how realistic this is but this is the kind of deal that would make sense for us.

 

 

If not, this team will continue developing and maintaining cap flexibility that gives us legit options by the time Golden State is beginning to look mortal.

 

This is why Lebron is the perfect guy to go after. He won't sign a long term deal, so every off-season that cap space opens up. As long as our FO doesn't go far over the cap, we will open up 30 mil of cap space every season! If Randle and Ingram are gone, we have a good couple of years before we have to even think about paying Ball or Kuzma. When that time comes, ditch Bron and sign another big name player before we have to go over the cap to maintain Ball and Kuzma. Otherwise, all of this cap flexability will be gone once we have to resign all of these guys anyway! We could legit have Kuz and Ball 3 years into their careers with 50-60 mil in cap space after competing for two seasons. I know this is a bit of a stretch and our FO probably isn't this smart but this is possible.

 

 

sit back and watch the young kids grow and hope we can get PG this summer. 

 

I think it will be you that sits back and watches us go after Bron and put our youth on the table. This is the reason for all of the moves we've made. The Lakers want to compete now! This was the reason for the changes made to our FO. This is happening! Whether we strike out or not is an entirely different conversation.


Edited by KidRN, February 13, 2018 - 04:00 PM.


#36 Tensai

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Posted February 13, 2018 - 06:11 PM

If the current kids are the version of Divac, Van Exel, Eddie Jones, Elden Campbell, then they will pave the way for Kobe and Shaq when the time comes. We don't seem to understand it. We can't go from 20 wins to 60 wins in a season or two (with Lebron or not) We need to grind those wins.

 

No pain, no gain.


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#37 MrRJ

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Posted February 14, 2018 - 10:35 AM

If the current kids are the version of Divac, Van Exel, Eddie Jones, Elden Campbell, then they will pave the way for Kobe and Shaq when the time comes. We don't seem to understand it. We can't go from 20 wins to 60 wins in a season or two (with Lebron or not) We need to grind those wins.

 

No pain, no gain.

1. Stop living in the past.
2. The Lakers won 53 games the year before Kobe was drafted.
3. Lakers need to at least make the playoffs soon with a young core. It's been 4 years (probably going on 5)



#38 bfc1125roy

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Posted February 14, 2018 - 12:08 PM

Y’all are so weirdly obsessed with winning by any means necessary that you don’t consider the cons. LeBron is an all-timer and the best in the game, but we just witnessed first-hand the [expletive] show that was occurring in Cleveland.

The same people who want LeBron are the same people who don’t think we can beat Golden State with him, so are you prepared for the drama when we lose? Because we know the expectation is to win and anything short of that is going to cause chaos. We know damn well LeBron is only signing 1 + 1 deals as a way of holding the franchise hostage and using all the leverage he can with potential roster moves. Check out these JR and TT deals he advocated for, which were okay in hindsight but are now approaching Deng levels of movability.

There’s legit concerns and I’m not even sure a roster with LeBron and PG can beat Golden State, so why deal with all that drama for anything less than a sure thing? You’d have to move Ingram or Kuzma for a Kevin Love/Chris Bosh caliber player (or hope he becomes one) just to be in the conversation.

I get that we’re all Laker fans and we’re used to winning, but the process to getting back to that level has changed. No Kobe. No Magic. What’s the solution? Y’all want to go buy our own version or Kobe and Magic in LeBron? Lol. This is how the league works now...sit back and watch the young kids grow and hope we can get PG this summer. If not, this team will continue developing and maintaining cap flexibility that gives us legit options by the time Golden State is beginning to look mortal.

 

We can beat GSW with PG and LBJ if we have Randle and get rid of Luke. I made a thread about this explaining why in detail. 


Edited by bfc1125roy, February 14, 2018 - 12:09 PM.


#39 bfc1125roy

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Posted February 14, 2018 - 12:12 PM

Pretty much this, but a lot of guys are so desperate to win that they’ll accept anything. Never really understood that from a fans perspective. I want my team to win, sure, but I want it to feel earned and organic. I’m seeing more and more people weirdly obsessed with it.

Look at the last 10 rings. Yeah we had Shaq and Kareem, but Magic and Kobe both came up thru the org and they were true “Lakers.” As corny as it sounds. Especially with LeBron, who is already established and already late into his career...would almost seem like a cheat code. Part of the process and being a fan are the ups and downs. Before we three peated, Shaq and Kobe got spanked by Malone and Jazz and the Twin Towers. Kobe lost to Phoenix, then we finally landed Gasol (who I liken to PG...both can be embraced by the city and didn’t have the body of work to be recognized as all-time greats just yet) to get us over the hump. A lot of you want to build something overnight with Bron...just don’t get it. That ain’t our guy...and that would probably be the cheapest ring this franchise ever won.

 

That's a bunch of feel good BS. You always get the best players you can. You think the Celtics give a [expletive] that they got Hayward and Horford via FA/trades. Or GSW cares that they got Durant via FA? I don't hear anyone whining that the Miami rings weren't organic.

 

And why the hell is getting PG not cheap but LeBron is? Just because PG isn't an all-time great yet? What the [expletive]? That's totally arbitrary and sounds like you're just hating on LeBron. 

 

This is a competitive game. You play to win, you play to get rings. 10 years from now, nobody will say our ring was cheap. Instead they'll comment on how we have more than Boston. 


Edited by bfc1125roy, February 14, 2018 - 12:13 PM.

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#40 GCMD

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Posted February 14, 2018 - 03:27 PM

That's a bunch of feel good BS. You always get the best players you can. You think the Celtics give a [expletive] that they got Hayward and Horford via FA/trades. Or GSW cares that they got Durant via FA? I don't hear anyone whining that the Miami rings weren't organic.

 

And why the hell is getting PG not cheap but LeBron is? Just because PG isn't an all-time great yet? What the [expletive]? That's totally arbitrary and sounds like you're just hating on LeBron. 

 

This is a competitive game. You play to win, you play to get rings. 10 years from now, nobody will say our ring was cheap. Instead they'll comment on how we have more than Boston. 

 

 

Have to say I agree 100%.

 

Only whiny, spoiled, overly-priviledged LAKERS FANS would complain about HOW we win.  Most teams would KILL to have a CHANCE to sign LeBron and PG13 this summer but noooooo....we have people here complaining about 4 guys who have been in the league a combined <10 years and how WINNING with LeBron will affect them?!!!

 

LOL.

 

It's sad we have to go through this.  Should be a no-brainer but instead, people are choosing to NOT use their brain and think with their HEARTS.

 

Lakers still have that huge TV deal with TWC/Spectrum...BILLIONS of dollars and their own channel.  Magic and Jeanie know that they need stars.  They aren't going to listen to the bleeding hearts that don't want LeBron because that would not make basketball or business sense.

 

Even if LeBron and PG13 don't beat GSW, they will win a lot of ball games, make BILLIONS in marketing/ad revenue and make LA a PRIME Free Agent Destination again.  It's the first step in making this Franchise relevant again and not a laughingstock.

 

The Lakers still have guys developing who will be able to take over in 3-5 years...Ball will be 25, Ingram 25, Kuzma 27, Randle 28...near their primes with Ball and Ingram still about 2 years away from their primes...

 

As long as we don't trade away our youth to get LeBron and PG13, it's almost guaranteed that we will try to sign them this summer.  No LOGICAL reason we shouldn't.


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