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2018 Lakers Free Agency/Trade Discussion


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#2521 DanishLakerFan

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Posted Today, 07:17 AM

would take kawhi over that any day.

Over what?



#2522 LACAS

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Posted Today, 09:00 AM

Over what?

 

I believe he meant: Kawhi>Boogie



#2523 last stand 2.0

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Posted Today, 10:00 AM

I’m thinking if the cavs and thunder both lose in the first round our chances increase considerably of signing those guys
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#2524 UKUGA

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Posted Today, 10:01 AM

The Wizards need more than just an athletic big, they need to simply blow it up.  It was evident when all the success and team play began when Wall was out.  Wall is one of those players whom has the Star label, posts up solid numbers, but just doesn't move the needle on a winning team.

 

The thing is the Wizards are stuck financially already with huge long term deals already set in stone in Wall, Beal, Porter, and Mahinmi/Gortat. Those 5 take up about $95 million in cap space alone so the Wizards you see now is what you'll get unless a major piece is moved.

 

I didn't say it was all they needed.  I just said they needed it.

 

"All the success" without Wall was a little overblown - it lasted a few weeks, but then they fell form the 4th seed to the 8th seed - all without Wall in the line-up.  

 

The statement you made about Wall "not moving the needle" ends up being said about a large number of stars whose teams haven't won titles.  You could have said it about all the Raptors, you could say it about Antekoumpo, people say it about George, Westbrook, people even said it about Kobe.   People once said it about Clyde Drexler - he couldn't win - then he was the missing piece for Houston to win it's 2nd title.  

 

Wall has been in the East his entire career, and Lebron James has won the East every year he's been in the league.  Accordingly, almost every other star in the East can get the label of "doesn't really help his team win."  

 

The East is not very good.  Washington was probably the third best team in the East last year.   They are probably about 5th right now.   If Lebron leaves, then Washington could potentially re-tool and be back near the top again.    

 

This is a franchise that hasn't won a title in 40 years.  "Blowing it up" when you have one of the better teams you've had in that time frame is pretty risky, especially when you have a top PG.  Toronto stayed the course and is now in the best position to win the East that they have ever been in their 22 year history.  

 

One of the biggest issues they have, as you note, is money.  The $170MM contract is dangerous.  They were in sort of a lose-lose with Wall and that contract.  I understand why they did it.  I also understand why they would have chose not to do it.

 

To me, it makes more sense to try and figure out a way to make it work by moving around pieces you have, especially when you have a premier player.

 

It's been a while since the Lakers had a talent the caliber of John Wall; accordingly, I think some turn their nose up at the prospects a player like that creates for a team, especially for a sad franchise like Washington, who drafted and developed the guy.  

 

https://www.washingt...m=.4d5093857440

 

Everyone has a take on John Wall and the Washington Wizards these days. Some say they’re better off without him and point to the 10-4 record the Wizards have compiled since he underwent knee surgery in January. Others scoff at the idea and point to the fairly obvious fact that Wall, a five-time all-star, is better than Tomas Satoransky, his second-year understudy.

The truth is somewhere in between. And the undeniable fact is that the Wizards signed Wall to a four-year, $170 million contract extension that doesn’t kick in until July 2019. And they did this for a reason. Whether these Wizards will be the team that finally advances to a conference final or again falls flat in the playoffs, it will be with Wall — assuming he returns from his recent surgery — on the court and heavily involved.

 

“There’s no question that we can add some of the things that we’ve done,” Wizards Coach Scott Brooks said before Wednesday’s game. “But we also want to make sure he brings what he brings. The guy is the fastest guy in the league going basket-to-basket. He generates four or five easy buckets for himself, and he generates six or seven easy three-point shots for our perimeter shooters, let alone our bigs for layups. We need that.”

That is the conundrum when trying to decipher what to make of this Wizards surge without their star. The Wizards have fundamentally changed who they are without Wall. They averaged 23.2 assists (11th in the NBA) and 281.7 passes per game (27th) before Wall left the lineup. Entering Wednesday night’s game, Washington was leading the NBA in assists (30.2) and ranked 10th with 310.2 passes per game over the previous 13 without him.

But in playing that way, the Wizards have sacrificed in other areas — and, notably, in areas in which Wall thrives. They are attempting more than two fewer drives per game and five fewer free throws, and they’re drawing three fewer fouls.

The stats, indeed, back up the eye test. Sure, the Wizards are moving the ball more with Wall watching from the bench. But that’s because Wall’s absence leaves just one player — Bradley Beal — capable of consistently breaking down the defense. That ball movement is necessary for the Wizards to have any chance at consistent offensive production.

“We have changed a little bit how we play,” Brooks said. “We’ve had to. I’m not taking away anything from Tomas, but he doesn’t have the abilities that John does. So we had to change to have the success we are having.”

When the Wizards are at their best, every player on the court is a threat — and that lies at the heart of what Washington needs to be when Wall eventually returns. As fun as the Wizards have been lately, the playoffs expose all weaknesses. The crucible of a seven-game series against the same opponent — and the extensive scouting that comes with it — would reveal the limitations of a Wizards team without Wall.

What the Wizards need is for Wall to come back and be the best version of himself — something he clearly wasn’t for large stretches of this season when his knee slowed him. To beat the elite teams in this league, elite talent is required. And Wall remains an elite talent.

But it is combining that elite talent with Beal, with an incorporated and invigorated Porter, with an emerging role player in Kelly Oubre Jr., that finally could lift the Wizards to the place they have spent four decades hoping to reach.

“We don’t want [Wall] to change,” Brooks said. “Tomas has played better because he’s gotten more confident. When John comes back, Tomas isn’t going to play those minutes, but the 15 to 20 minutes is going to be better because he knows he can do the things he’s been able to do with John out.

“But John is elite. We don’t want to take his pick-and-roll game away. We don’t want to take his speed coast-to-coast away. We want to make sure he understands we want that and we need that. But the other guys are still going to have continue to play well and continue to grow as well.”


Edited by UKUGA, Today, 10:03 AM.

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Don't feed the trolls. 


#2525 UKUGA

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Posted Today, 10:09 AM

Not necessarily.  The odds of winning it all is always slim w/o a top 3-5 player and a great supporting cast.  They are watchable and good on most nights.  Can't just blow it up to blow it up.  In LA you would have to but these small market teams need to have watchable basketball.  

 

It's an excellent post, Jodie.   The Wizards are a sad-sack franchise, but a team that the city and fan base actually got behind last season, and will again this post-season if they can force Toronto to 6+.   Wall is big here in Washington.  He's no Alex Ovechkin, but he's still a big star.   

 

Every year since Wall's been in the league,  Lebron James has been in the Finals.   Accordingly, no one in the East, other than Wade & Irving, get any real credit for being a star player who can help a team win.

 

People create a narrative around winning and losing.  It's understood.  It's the easiest statistic to analyze, but it's also lazy.  


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Don't feed the trolls. 


#2526 DanishLakerFan

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Posted Today, 10:27 AM

I believe he meant: Kawhi>Boogie

Sure i agree with that.

 

I think the main priority has to be to get commitments from Lebron and George, then see what happens from there on out. We might have the assets to make a strong case for a Kawhi move, although he would have to force his way here.



#2527 last stand 2.0

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Posted Today, 10:43 AM

If we get lebron I’m thinking shaq with the heat. I’m seeing something like 2 years as a dominant player still and then I’m kinda hoping we cut ties to a different direction.

But I really want the guy tbh and I think it’s setting up to be George and lebron coming here. And with the recent brook Lopez comments I’m even more ok with trading Ingram and kuzma for Leonard since Lopez said he’ll take less to play for a contender here

Lopez
Lebron
Leonard
George
Ball

Can compete for it all and easily overtakes Houston. And if we can keep hart off the bench and zubac/ Bryant

And then we have an option to sign some crafty vets. Idk I’d like our chances quite a bit.
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#2528 lakerfan98

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Posted Today, 11:03 AM

If we could sign and trade Randle with Ingram and maybe say the Cavs pick I'd consider it. Still leaves us with Zo, Hart, Kuz, and all our future picks. If we have to trade Ingram and Kuzma and then lose Randle for nothing that would suck. Swapping out BI, Kuz, and Randle for Kawhi, George, and LeBron is a massive upgrade but that team is SUPER top heavy with no depth and capped out.

Edited by lakerfan98, Today, 11:06 AM.

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#2529 LakeShow1o1

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Posted Today, 11:06 AM

One of the bigger debates on the forum have been the whole trading for Kawhi and how much some fans would be willing to give up in order to acquire him.

 

Some are willing to give up 2 young pieces while I'm on the boat of strictly giving up one. 

 

My question is.  Is it really even worth giving up 2 key young cornerstones via trade when you can possibly just wait a season and acquire Kawhi via free agency?


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#2530 Wilt Chamberneezy

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Posted Today, 11:12 AM

Would anyone give up Ball for Lillard? Assuming Lebron doesn't sign with us and we are only able to get PG.

 

Pg - Lillard

Sg - PG

SF- Ingram

PF - Randle

C - Lopez



#2531 lakerfan98

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Posted Today, 11:13 AM

That's the leverage I would use. The Spurs clearly don't want to pay the dude. I'm looking to send them a package with Ingram as the main centerpiece. With Randle too if possible. He gets paid, goes home to Texas, and gets to play for a HOF coach and perennial playoff team. Something about giving up BI and Kuz/Zo AND losing Randle for nothing because we're out of cap rubs me the wrong way.

Hey...Boston is another team linked to him. If they give up Brown AND Tatum I'll eat my shirt.

#2532 last stand 2.0

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Posted Today, 11:36 AM

If we could sign and trade Randle with Ingram and maybe say the Cavs pick I'd consider it. Still leaves us with Zo, Hart, Kuz, and all our future picks. If we have to trade Ingram and Kuzma and then lose Randle for nothing that would suck. Swapping out BI, Kuz, and Randle for Kawhi, George, and LeBron is a massive upgrade but that team is SUPER top heavy with no depth and capped out.


If we could do that, that’d be great, having kuzma and hart off the bench with those 3 would be tough to beat. And kuzma could be the backup for both James and Leonard which would get him on the floor 25 min a game.

At that point we’d have a reasonable bench of zubac, Bryant, kuzma and hart

And we could just use the vet min to sign guys to fill out the rest

Also lonzo could man the point 34 min a game
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#2533 last stand 2.0

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Posted Today, 11:38 AM

That's the leverage I would use. The Spurs clearly don't want to pay the dude. I'm looking to send them a package with Ingram as the main centerpiece. With Randle too if possible. He gets paid, goes home to Texas, and gets to play for a HOF coach and perennial playoff team. Something about giving up BI and Kuz/Zo AND losing Randle for nothing because we're out of cap rubs me the wrong way.

Hey...Boston is another team linked to him. If they give up Brown AND Tatum I'll eat my shirt.


I doubt they do. That’s a huge haul for them. You’re talking 2 young guys who’re playing HUGE for them. It’d actually make no sense for them as a franchise to do that. Those two have been just massive for them and would just leave them with Leonard and Irving as opposed to the very balanced team they have now. Not to mention both guys will improve and if lebron leaves the east they’ll be favorites
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#2534 UKUGA

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Posted Today, 04:42 PM

That's the leverage I would use. The Spurs clearly don't want to pay the dude. I'm looking to send them a package with Ingram as the main centerpiece. With Randle too if possible. He gets paid, goes home to Texas, and gets to play for a HOF coach and perennial playoff team. Something about giving up BI and Kuz/Zo AND losing Randle for nothing because we're out of cap rubs me the wrong way.

Hey...Boston is another team linked to him. If they give up Brown AND Tatum I'll eat my shirt.


Where are you getting that the Spurs “clearly don’t want to pay” Leonard?

Don't feed the trolls. 


#2535 Tensai

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Posted Today, 05:28 PM

I’m thinking if the cavs and thunder both lose in the first round our chances increase considerably of signing those guys

 

Wouldn't that be the other way? Why would Paul George or Lebron consider playing with even more inexperienced / worse players than the team they are on? Let's say George is sentimental about coming home, there is no reason for Lebron.


fXlFKv8.gif

 


#2536 FranklinPeanuts

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Posted Today, 05:45 PM

Where are you getting that the Spurs “clearly don’t want to pay” Leonard?


https://www.ocregist...-to-the-lakers/

#2537 last stand 2.0

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Posted Today, 06:56 PM

Wouldn't that be the other way? Why would Paul George or Lebron consider playing with even more inexperienced / worse players than the team they are on? Let's say George is sentimental about coming home, there is no reason for Lebron.


Um well to play together? Whilst the lakers have assets both the thunder and cavs don’t have to continue to improve the team after they are signed?

The same reason he left Miami for Cleveland. People quickly forget that Cleveland had Irving a young rising star and assets out of the ass to trade which resulted in Kevin love

So who’s to say lebron doesn’t see the same deal in LA, especially if george joins
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#2538 KidRN

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Posted Today, 07:25 PM

Um well to play together? Whilst the lakers have assets both the thunder and cavs don’t have to continue to improve the team after they are signed?
The same reason he left Miami for Cleveland. People quickly forget that Cleveland had Irving a young rising star and assets out of the ass to trade which resulted in Kevin love
So who’s to say lebron doesn’t see the same deal in LA, especially if george joins

We don't have a Kyrie type player. Our 2nd best player would have to be signed first or at least committed to joining the team.




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