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Kyrie Irving Traded to Celtics for Crowder/Zizic/Thomas/Nets '18 pick


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#61 manaro90

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Posted July 22, 2017 - 10:52 AM

nba offseason already more interesting than war of the planet of the apes


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#62 kball

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Posted July 22, 2017 - 10:57 AM

Hope if he's dealt, Cavs get enough back to keep celtics out of finals.

That would suck.

 

Though Warriors beating Boston 4-0 might actually make me happy too


Praying for  1. Some Cohesion (Ill fitting parts with young bucks, new guys, and those playing for next contracts may muck things up all season) 2. Better Coaching, No More Tanking (Last season was more of the latter but not sure how much of the former we can count on. Walton with something to prove this season as much as any Laker player) 3. Rookie Watch (Hoping Lonzo outshines his daddy (ROTY??), and Kuzma finds minutes and makes a push for all rook 2nd team)

READY FOR SEASON!!!

 

 


#63 Artest37

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Posted July 22, 2017 - 12:40 PM

Hope if he's dealt, Cavs get enough back to keep celtics out of finals.
That would suck.
 
Though Warriors beating Boston 4-0 might actually make me happy too



That would be kind of cool. All that work and maneuvering and stockpiling by Ainge only to be spanked 4-0 would be fun for Lakers fans.


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#64    

   

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Posted July 22, 2017 - 01:25 PM

But they would still get another finals appearance on their resume as opposed to us.

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#65 DanishLakerFan

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Posted July 23, 2017 - 01:38 AM

Carmelo and Porzingis for Kyrie is really the only thing that makes sense in my opinion.

Porzingis? Are you kidding. Porzingis is untouchable .



#66 DanishLakerFan

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Posted July 23, 2017 - 01:48 AM

I don't get this thing where if you're not a DPOY candidate you're automatically a horrible defender. Equally as bad defensively? He doesn't have the tools or the size to be be great defender but that's not asked of him. When he's locked in, he's a average defender in this league and that's all you can ask for.

Well, that isn't the case. Plenty of PGs are solid on the defensive end - Lowry, Wall, CP3, Conley, Hill, Jrue etc. Westbrook is decent. Curry is average or slightly below. 

 

Kyrie, Dame and IT are not "average" defensively. They're beyond horrible. Hell, D'Angelo Russell is better than those guys.

 

 

Kyrie Irving is a top 3 point guard after Westbrook and Curry. It's baseless to call Kyrie Irving overrated.

This is why he's overrated. He's not a top 3, nor is he top 5.

 

Westbrook, Curry, CP3 and Wall are all far better and i dont think its all that close. I'd say Kyrie is on the level of IT, Lillard, Lowry, Kemba etc.



#67 Massacre

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Posted July 23, 2017 - 03:14 AM

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In what world is Kyrie a top 3 PG? Paul, Wall, Westbrook, Curry, and Lillard have all proven to be better. I think Boston improves if they swap IT for Kyrie and Lowry is barely an average PG when the playoffs roll around. Other than those 2, he has no argument for being above the other 5 guys.

Edited by Massacre, July 23, 2017 - 03:14 AM.


#68 kball

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Posted July 23, 2017 - 03:14 AM

Well, that isn't the case. Plenty of PGs are solid on the defensive end - Lowry, Wall, CP3, Conley, Hill, Jrue etc. Westbrook is decent. Curry is average or slightly below. 

 

Kyrie, Dame and IT are not "average" defensively. They're beyond horrible. Hell, D'Angelo Russell is better than those guys.

 

 

This is why he's overrated. He's not a top 3, nor is he top 5.

 

Westbrook, Curry, CP3 and Wall are all far better and i dont think its all that close. I'd say Kyrie is on the level of IT, Lillard, Lowry, Kemba etc.

Unless you take into account how Kyrie has gone deeper and outperformed on the biggest stage all of those guys except Curry.

 

Clutch, bigtime shot maker of the highest order on the biggest stage in the league in multiple years will/has to count for something.

 

For sure i'd rather have Steph.

And RW.

Then it gets muddier.

I have Wall slightly higher and more desirable than Kyrie.

But Kyrie beats out others imo.

 

All that said, wow doesnt it seem like GS has basically rejiggered the entire league?

So many pieces moving and a lot to be excited about next season for hoop fans.

 

BTW anyone notice Warriors ALSO got stronger


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Praying for  1. Some Cohesion (Ill fitting parts with young bucks, new guys, and those playing for next contracts may muck things up all season) 2. Better Coaching, No More Tanking (Last season was more of the latter but not sure how much of the former we can count on. Walton with something to prove this season as much as any Laker player) 3. Rookie Watch (Hoping Lonzo outshines his daddy (ROTY??), and Kuzma finds minutes and makes a push for all rook 2nd team)

READY FOR SEASON!!!

 

 


#69 Massacre

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Posted July 23, 2017 - 03:21 AM

^ All those guys (Wall, WB, Curry, Lillard, CP3) are #1 options on their teams and have performed at elite levels in the playoffs. Let's be real, Kyrie plays with LeBron (a big reason why he's gone deeper than all those guys, so I don't see that as very relevant) and that's extremely beneficial for a player with his skill set.

#70 bigvee

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Posted July 23, 2017 - 04:52 AM

You guys realize Kyrie just turned 25 right?

Steph - 29. Wall - 26. Russ - 28. CP - 32. Conley - 29. Lowry - 31.

Unlike Westbrook and Wall, Kyrie's game is not dependent on athleticism. It's a question mark on how many more years freak athletes like those guys have left. CP is at the end of his prime. Conley and Lowry are solid but are a year or two away from their decline.

Kyrie is one of the few players in the NBA who we know is a star AND has 5-7 great/star level years left, forbidding injury. Plainly because of his play style - he's always going to have an amazing handle and is always going to be a fantastic shooter from any range. There's a very short list of guys who I can say that about.

A GM evaluating Kyrie heavily weighs his age and his skillful style of play against his contract and moves forward based on that.

There's this talk of the point guard market being polluted. I don't buy that. I only count 9 teams with with star point guards already - Celtics, Raptors, Wizards, Warriors, Rockets, Thunder and Blazers, Hornets, Grizzlies. If, out of the 21 remaining teams, only about half are in the position to make offers, you still have about a third of the league after this one player. That value is sky high.

Edited by bigvee, July 23, 2017 - 04:53 AM.

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Posted July 23, 2017 - 10:17 AM

BTW anyone notice Warriors ALSO got stronger

Other than not retaining McGee so far yes. Kept everyone else pretty much. Added Nick Young over Ian Clark (upgrade), Omri Casspi (underrated move), and Jordan Bell (potential steal).

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#72 kball

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Posted July 23, 2017 - 04:47 PM

Did JaVelle already sign elsewhere?

Last i paid attention he was still expected to come  back


Praying for  1. Some Cohesion (Ill fitting parts with young bucks, new guys, and those playing for next contracts may muck things up all season) 2. Better Coaching, No More Tanking (Last season was more of the latter but not sure how much of the former we can count on. Walton with something to prove this season as much as any Laker player) 3. Rookie Watch (Hoping Lonzo outshines his daddy (ROTY??), and Kuzma finds minutes and makes a push for all rook 2nd team)

READY FOR SEASON!!!

 

 


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Posted July 23, 2017 - 04:52 PM

Nope. Hasn't signed anywhere. A couple of teams were interested in him for a little while including the Clippers, but then they signed a few folks and that seems to be off now.

He's allegedly not too happy with the Warriors because he feels he deserves more after what he did last year and wasn't too thrilled with the amount they threw at Zaza in comparison as well as automatically giving him the starting spot back yet again.

He's been posting workout videos and photos on his instagram desperately trying to showcase himself to anyone.

Warriors are still not entirely impossible, but it's really gonna be almost entirely up to him and whether he's willing to change his mindset a bit and humble himself.

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#74 bigvee

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Posted July 23, 2017 - 04:59 PM

Nope. Hasn't signed anywhere. A couple of teams were interested in him for a little while including the Clippers, but then they signed a few folks and that seems to be off now.

He's allegedly not too happy with the Warriors because he feels he deserves more after what he did last year and wasn't too thrilled with the amount they threw at Zaza in comparison as well as automatically giving him the starting spot back yet again.

He's been posting workout videos and photos on his instagram desperately trying to showcase himself to anyone.

Warriors are still not entirely impossible, but it's really gonna be almost entirely up to him and whether he's willing to change his mindset a bit and humble himself.


Teams are accepting that they're no where near Golden State talent-wise and they can't just seamlessly incorporate him into a lineup. He also looked completely lost out there in the finals on defense so no playoff team will wanna deal with that.

Also interesting to see that LeBron will not waive his no trade for any team in the league no matter what happens with Kyrie. I hope they somehow rebuild their roster to LeBron and a bunch of 3andD guys and see how well they can contain the Warriors switching everything.

#75 Tensai

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Posted July 23, 2017 - 07:16 PM

LMA + Dejounte Murray for Kyrie probably works best among the desired teams Kyrie put out.

 

Kyrie and Kawhi in Popovich's system can become the answer to Warriors' Curry - Durant duo. Defensively they will need to add some players though. Don't think they have anyone to replace LMA.


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#76 Tensai

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Posted July 23, 2017 - 07:18 PM

Rose / Smith / Lebron / Love / LMA is a good lineup for Cavs.


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#77 DanishLakerFan

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Posted July 23, 2017 - 10:18 PM

Unless you take into account how Kyrie has gone deeper and outperformed on the biggest stage all of those guys except Curry.

 

Clutch, bigtime shot maker of the highest order on the biggest stage in the league in multiple years will/has to count for something.

 

For sure i'd rather have Steph.

And RW.

Then it gets muddier.

I have Wall slightly higher and more desirable than Kyrie.

But Kyrie beats out others imo.

 

All that said, wow doesnt it seem like GS has basically rejiggered the entire league?

So many pieces moving and a lot to be excited about next season for hoop fans.

 

BTW anyone notice Warriors ALSO got stronger

 

The reason why Kyrie has gone deeper in the playoffs is because of Lebron. He did nothing when he was in charge.

 

Kyrie is a fine player, but he's not much better than guys like Kemba or Lillard and while he is only 25, i dont think that gives him all that much upside over someone like John Wall (26).

 

If we are talking about ONE game, i'd say Kyrie is a solid bet as one of the top options, as he can get very hot. But for a series, a playoffs or a season where half the game is played on the defensive end,  i think there's a handfull of guys that are better options both in the short and long term.



#78 Artest37

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Posted July 23, 2017 - 11:00 PM

I have yet to see a smart move by the Cavs that wasn't driven by an (allegedly) LeBron led agenda. So I don't see them making any moves to accommodate the Kyrie situation. I can see Gilbert just standing pat and making Kyrie run through the end of his contract.


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#79 DanishLakerFan

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Posted July 24, 2017 - 12:24 AM

I have yet to see a smart move by the Cavs that wasn't driven by an (allegedly) LeBron led agenda. So I don't see them making any moves to accommodate the Kyrie situation. I can see Gilbert just standing pat and making Kyrie run through the end of his contract.


 

Catering to Lebron and paying luxury taxes is one thing when he can take you to the Finals every year, but for a guy who likely is gone by the end of next season i'd say there comes a point where Dan Gilbert has to force his own agenda. When Kyrie wants out due to the uncertainty regarding Lebron, who constantly hold his team hostage by threatening to leave, then that point have been reached imo. 

 

If i was Dan Gilbert i would give Lebron an ultimatum. Commit to the team or the team starts building for a future without Lebron.  

 

If they started selling guys like Kyrie and Love to the highest bidder, i'm sure they could get multiple first rounders and young players in the process. That's far better than trying to trade Kyrie for cents on the dollar for short term succes only to see Lebron bolt in the summer.


Edited by DanishLakerFan, July 24, 2017 - 12:24 AM.


#80 Tensai

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Posted July 24, 2017 - 10:04 PM

http://www.espn.com/...tial-trades-nba

 

Such a retarded hit piece by Zach Lowe (!) on Kyrie. I'm shocked to be honest. The baseless accusations, one-sided arguments, all-you-can-attack bonanza.


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