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2017 Lakers Free Agency/Trade Discussion


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#7521 BasketballIQ

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Posted October 31, 2017 - 08:47 PM

He doesn't have to be a version of anyone

Thwre should be spme twmplate for success

#7522 GCMD

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Posted October 31, 2017 - 08:49 PM

Hey maybe the sixers will take deng. I think they're lacking veteran leadership

 

 

LOL!!!!!!

 

You're on FIRE tonight...LOL...


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#7523 GCMD

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Posted October 31, 2017 - 08:51 PM

Thwre should be spme twmplate for success

 

 

 

Both of those things can be true without both being applicable to this situation.

 

Does Randle have a LEGIT template?  Please, PLEASE say Draymond...

 

How about Ingram?  Please, PLEASE say KD...



#7524 ChichoGarcy

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Posted October 31, 2017 - 09:27 PM

Did Okafor had some other discipline issues/problems in Phila besides that fight (or discussion) in the street on his rookie year?

Edited by ChichoGarcy, October 31, 2017 - 09:27 PM.


#7525 LACAS

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Posted November 01, 2017 - 04:42 AM

Hey maybe the sixers will take deng. I think they're lacking veteran leadership

 

That would be a dream come true... not Okafor but dumping Deng... that said Okafor is still young, I'd play him over Bogut and Zubac at this point.



#7526 LACAS

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Posted November 01, 2017 - 05:01 AM

This team being so young is just 2 solid vets away... I would take any combo of Bron, PG13 and Boogie. 

 

BTW trading any of our young core this seasons for someone who becomes a FA this coming summer is poor business, unless you think the move puts us in immediate contention... just saying.


Edited by LACAS, November 01, 2017 - 05:02 AM.


#7527 UKUGA

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Posted November 01, 2017 - 05:50 AM

https://www.theringe...s-anthony-davis


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Don't feed the trolls. 


#7528 GCMD

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Posted November 01, 2017 - 10:30 AM

This team being so young is just 2 solid vets away... I would take any combo of Bron, PG13 and Boogie. 

 

BTW trading any of our young core this seasons for someone who becomes a FA this coming summer is poor business, unless you think the move puts us in immediate contention... just saying.

 

 

 

Realistically, any of those 3 would want 1 of the other 2 to already be on the team they chose to go to.

 

All of the teams they currently play for have players they don't mind trading away to attract/obtain 1 of the other players.

 

Some of our current players are not worth lowering our chances to obtain 2 Allstars.

 

 

I understand what you're saying but I just don't see a way around it.  Everyone knows what we're trying to do and they aren't going to sit back and let it happen.  The Cavs and NOP will do whatever they think they need to do keep those guys and honestly, they both have at least 1 AllStar already on their teams (Isaiah Thomas/Love for the Cavs and AD/Jrue Holiday for NOP).  No matter what we think, Ball won't be considered on their level because he's not on the same timeline as any of those players.  Same for Ingram.

 

We don't want to trade Ingram and there would be riots if we traded Ball...those are the only 2 that would even get OKC (PG13) or NOP (Cousins) on the phone.  If we have to trade Ingram to obtain either PG13 (along with Clarkson) or Cousins (along with Lopez), you do it.  Not because we don't like Ingram...we do it to put ourselves on the same level as the Cavs or NOP when it comes to attracting LeBron...because the Cavs would trade ANYONE on their roster to add either of those guys.

 

Now does that mean we just jump to make that trade right now?  No.  I'm ok with waiting to see how Ingram progresses.  

 

Assuming Ball/Ingram alone with the Lakers Name will be more attractive than legit Star Talent on the roster doesn't seem like business to me.  Seems like playing the lottery as a career.  Gotta break a few eggs to make an omelette.

 

Again, I understand what you're saying and why you're saying it.  I just don't share the optimism that everything will fall into place without other teams doing everything they can to prevent it.



#7529 KidRN

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Posted November 01, 2017 - 10:38 AM

Realistically, any of those 3 would want 1 of the other 2 to already be on the team they chose to go to.

 

All of the teams they currently play for have players they don't mind trading away to attract/obtain 1 of the other players.

 

Some of our current players are not worth lowering our chances to obtain 2 Allstars.

 

 

I understand what you're saying but I just don't see a way around it.  Everyone knows what we're trying to do and they aren't going to sit back and let it happen.  The Cavs and NOP will do whatever they think they need to do keep those guys and honestly, they both have at least 1 AllStar already on their teams (Isaiah Thomas/Love for the Cavs and AD/Jrue Holiday for NOP).  No matter what we think, Ball won't be considered on their level because he's not on the same timeline as any of those players.  Same for Ingram.

 

We don't want to trade Ingram and there would be riots if we traded Ball...those are the only 2 that would even get OKC (PG13) or NOP (Cousins) on the phone.  If we have to trade Ingram to obtain either PG13 (along with Clarkson) or Cousins (along with Lopez), you do it.  Not because we don't like Ingram...we do it to put ourselves on the same level as the Cavs or NOP when it comes to attracting LeBron...because the Cavs would trade ANYONE on their roster to add either of those guys.

 

Now does that mean we just jump to make that trade right now?  No.  I'm ok with waiting to see how Ingram progresses.  

 

Assuming Ball/Ingram alone with the Lakers Name will be more attractive than legit Star Talent on the roster doesn't seem like business to me.  Seems like playing the lottery as a career.  Gotta break a few eggs to make an omelette.

 

Again, I understand what you're saying and why you're saying it.  I just don't share the optimism that everything will fall into place without other teams doing everything they can to prevent it.

Why would we need to trade Ingram?

 

Those guys are free agents this year and Ingram is on a rookie deal



#7530 GCMD

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Posted November 01, 2017 - 10:43 AM

Why would we need to trade Ingram?

 

Those guys are free agents this year and Ingram is on a rookie deal

 

 

LOL...I didn't say "need" and I just broke down multiple reasons why it would increase our chances of landing a 2nd star this summer.  If you're not going to read it, kid, why even quote it?  LOL.

 

And if you just disagree, let's just leave that at that.  No need for a long dispute when a simple "agree to disagree" will suffice.  Won't change anything.



#7531 KidRN

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Posted November 01, 2017 - 11:02 AM

LOL...I didn't say "need" and I just broke down multiple reasons why it would increase our chances of landing a 2nd star this summer. If you're not going to read it, kid, why even quote it? LOL.

And if you just disagree, let's just leave that at that. No need for a long dispute when a simple "agree to disagree" will suffice. Won't change anything.

You didnt break down anything! You just get defensive anytime someone questions something you say.

I didn't disagree because im not even sure what you were trying to say.

Getting someone this season is better than waiting and attempting to attract both stars in the offseason?

Is that what you are trying to say?

That I do disagree with but that wasnt clearly stated in your post.

You should never make moves in hopes of another move happening later on.

Someone on GS could get hurt and Cleveland wins the championship...no more Bron

Also with Westbrook locked up, OKC has no reason to trade PG.

Edited by kidpolean, November 01, 2017 - 11:05 AM.


#7532 GCMD

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Posted November 01, 2017 - 11:36 AM

You didnt break down anything! You just get defensive anytime someone questions something you say.

I didn't disagree because im not even sure what you were trying to say.

Getting someone this season is better than waiting and attempting to attract both stars in the offseason?

Is that what you are trying to say?

That I do disagree with but that wasnt clearly stated in your post.

You should never make moves in hopes of another move happening later on.

Someone on GS could get hurt and Cleveland wins the championship...no more Bron

Also with Westbrook locked up, OKC has no reason to trade PG.

 

 

I said you didn't read my post and you just confirmed it.

 

Why do I have to rehash points I already made?

 

 

Realistically, any of those 3 would want 1 of the other 2 to already be on the team they chose to go to.

 

All of the teams they currently play for have players they don't mind trading away to attract/obtain 1 of the other players.

 

Some of our current players are not worth lowering our chances to obtain 2 Allstars.

 

 

I understand what you're saying but I just don't see a way around it.  Everyone knows what we're trying to do and they aren't going to sit back and let it happen.  The Cavs and NOP will do whatever they think they need to do keep those guys and honestly, they both have at least 1 AllStar already on their teams (Isaiah Thomas/Love for the Cavs and AD/Jrue Holiday for NOP).  No matter what we think, Ball won't be considered on their level because he's not on the same timeline as any of those players.  Same for Ingram.

 

We don't want to trade Ingram and there would be riots if we traded Ball...those are the only 2 that would even get OKC (PG13) or NOP (Cousins) on the phone.  If we have to trade Ingram to obtain either PG13 (along with Clarkson) or Cousins (along with Lopez), you do it.  Not because we don't like Ingram...we do it to put ourselves on the same level as the Cavs or NOP when it comes to attracting LeBron...because the Cavs would trade ANYONE on their roster to add either of those guys.

 

Now does that mean we just jump to make that trade right now?  No.  I'm ok with waiting to see how Ingram progresses.  

 

 

 

Assuming Ball/Ingram alone with the Lakers Name will be more attractive than legit Star Talent on the roster doesn't seem like business to me.  Seems like playing the lottery as a career.  Gotta break a few eggs to make an omelette.

 

Again, I understand what you're saying and why you're saying it.  I just don't share the optimism that everything will fall into place without other teams doing everything they can to prevent it.

 

 

 

And I'm not defensive.  I've just discussed things with you for long enough to know when you're getting on your soapbox and aren't really trying to discuss things.  You came at me with your accusation tone so instead of returning fire, I'd rather just bow out of this one.

 

I've posted my reasons.  If you disagree, that's fine.  I respect your opinion and your right to have it.



#7533 GCMD

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Posted November 01, 2017 - 11:41 AM

And for the record, trading for a Star this season will give us a better chance to land a 2nd star in the offseason.  That's what I was saying.  If you disagree, please provide your reasons.

 

Make sure you account for other teams that have an Allstar and who will be trying to ATTRACT at least 1 of the AllStars we are going after...

 

 

NOP will be trying to land PG13 or LeBron to pair with Cousins/AD - kills a chance to land 2 of the 3.

 

Cavs will be trying to land PG13 or Cousins to pair with LeBron - kills a chance to land 2 of the 3.

 

 

OKC will be trying to sell PG13 on STAYING with Westbrook/Melo...where PG13 is our best chance to land ONE star that attracts the other...and we don't have ANYTHING that can compete with Westbrook/Melo.

 

 

People saying "just keep our young guys" aren't considering the rest of the board (NBA).  They aren't going to sit back and let us form a super team and the only way this plan works is if Ingram and Ball look like ALL Stars whit year...not likely.  Not banking on that...nor should the Lakers as a business move.


Edited by GCMD, November 01, 2017 - 11:47 AM.


#7534 Jackson

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Posted November 01, 2017 - 12:37 PM

And for the record, trading for a Star this season will give us a better chance to land a 2nd star in the offseason.  That's what I was saying.  If you disagree, please provide your reasons.

 

Make sure you account for other teams that have an Allstar and who will be trying to ATTRACT at least 1 of the AllStars we are going after...

 

 

NOP will be trying to land PG13 or LeBron to pair with Cousins/AD - kills a chance to land 2 of the 3.

 

Cavs will be trying to land PG13 or Cousins to pair with LeBron - kills a chance to land 2 of the 3.

 

 

OKC will be trying to sell PG13 on STAYING with Westbrook/Melo...where PG13 is our best chance to land ONE star that attracts the other...and we don't have ANYTHING that can compete with Westbrook/Melo.

 

 

People saying "just keep our young guys" aren't considering the rest of the board (NBA).  They aren't going to sit back and let us form a super team and the only way this plan works is if Ingram and Ball look like ALL Stars whit year...not likely.  Not banking on that...nor should the Lakers as a business move.

That's true, and that's where the FO [expletive]ed up this off season in NOT landing PG13.



#7535 DaSmoothOperator

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Posted November 01, 2017 - 08:32 PM

Okafur probable to the Green Ones, Don’t think Bledsoe fits here well, depends on who FO is after and gets!

#7536 DaSmoothOperator

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Posted November 01, 2017 - 08:33 PM

Oh FO didn’t mess up anything if he comes cool if not it’s not the end of the Lakers!

#7537 DanishLakerFan

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Posted November 01, 2017 - 08:57 PM

And for the record, trading for a Star this season will give us a better chance to land a 2nd star in the offseason.  That's what I was saying.  If you disagree, please provide your reasons.

 

Make sure you account for other teams that have an Allstar and who will be trying to ATTRACT at least 1 of the AllStars we are going after...

 

 

NOP will be trying to land PG13 or LeBron to pair with Cousins/AD - kills a chance to land 2 of the 3.

 

Cavs will be trying to land PG13 or Cousins to pair with LeBron - kills a chance to land 2 of the 3.

 

 

OKC will be trying to sell PG13 on STAYING with Westbrook/Melo...where PG13 is our best chance to land ONE star that attracts the other...and we don't have ANYTHING that can compete with Westbrook/Melo.

 

 

People saying "just keep our young guys" aren't considering the rest of the board (NBA).  They aren't going to sit back and let us form a super team and the only way this plan works is if Ingram and Ball look like ALL Stars whit year...not likely.  Not banking on that...nor should the Lakers as a business move.

Landing a star in season may increase chance of landing number 2, but not a whole lot. At the same time, we risk losing a prime asset for nothing.

 

One of the interesting things about the Lakers next summer is that we (hopefully) can add two max guys while keeping these upsidey guys on cheap-ass rookie deals, which both can be used as trade chips later when their value (should be) up or kept which would prolong the "window" for the max guys.


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#7538 GCMD

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Posted November 01, 2017 - 11:06 PM

Landing a star in season may increase chance of landing number 2, but not a whole lot. At the same time, we risk losing a prime asset for nothing.

 

One of the interesting things about the Lakers next summer is that we (hopefully) can add two max guys while keeping these upsidey guys on cheap-ass rookie deals, which both can be used as trade chips later when their value (should be) up or kept which would prolong the "window" for the max guys.

 

 

 

I would LOVE to do that.  It's the absolute best case scenario but until we are a place that is both winning and a Free Agent Destination Hotspot, keeping the kids is not a priority over landing STARS.

 

If Ingram was Ben Simmons, I'd agree with you.  Can't miss star.  Ingram is NOT Simmons and the jury is still out on if he's a future AllStar or a really good role player.  IMHO, I haven't seen anything that leads me to believe Ingram is a 1st or 2nd option guy in this league.  I believe Ball is a Culture Changing, Franchise Cornerstone.  Again, my opinion.

 

Another important factor is how well we have been drafting.  Kuzma should have been a lottery pick and if we land a late first in the 2018 Draft, we have a legit chance to land ANOTHER guy who possibly should be a lottery pick.

 

 

I'm a LOT less worried about the future once we land Stars this summer...Stars should be our first priority, IMHO.

 

In fact, I'll go on record and say as long as we keep Kuzma, I'm fine with moving Ingram.  IMHO, his NBA and Lakers fit is undeniable and his potential as a star is (arguably) second only to Lonzo.  

 

I understand your point.  If we can keep all of our assets, we should.  I just disagree with that premise based on the fact that there are 29 other teams that have historically shown they will do any and everything to make sure the Los Angeles Lakers don't rise again.  LeBron and PG13 or Cousins in LA is a nightmare.  If everyone is dismayed about GSW's dominance, they will be EXPONENTIALLY more upset about the Lakers being on top again.

 

If you think it's going to be as easy as "sit back and let the chips fall into place", respectfully and with no insult meant, you're wrong.  

 

I'd like everyone to remember DeAndre Jordan to the Mavs...all of those guys had already AGREED to come together and form a Super-Team in Dallas.  As soon as it was announced, the Clippers went BAT-POOP crazy and pulled out ALL of the stops to keep him there.  

 

That was for a C with little to no post game who is maybe a borderline AllStar.  We are talking about luring two of 3 of the 10 best players (arguably) in the game.  Competition won't be fierce...it will be "Game of Thrones - Red Wedding meets Battle at The Wall" all over the NBA.



#7539 DanishLakerFan

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Posted November 02, 2017 - 12:18 AM

I would LOVE to do that.  It's the absolute best case scenario but until we are a place that is both winning and a Free Agent Destination Hotspot, keeping the kids is not a priority over landing STARS.

 

If Ingram was Ben Simmons, I'd agree with you.  Can't miss star.  Ingram is NOT Simmons and the jury is still out on if he's a future AllStar or a really good role player.  IMHO, I haven't seen anything that leads me to believe Ingram is a 1st or 2nd option guy in this league.  I believe Ball is a Culture Changing, Franchise Cornerstone.  Again, my opinion.

 

Another important factor is how well we have been drafting.  Kuzma should have been a lottery pick and if we land a late first in the 2018 Draft, we have a legit chance to land ANOTHER guy who possibly should be a lottery pick.

 

 

I'm a LOT less worried about the future once we land Stars this summer...Stars should be our first priority, IMHO.

 

In fact, I'll go on record and say as long as we keep Kuzma, I'm fine with moving Ingram.  IMHO, his NBA and Lakers fit is undeniable and his potential as a star is (arguably) second only to Lonzo.  

 

I understand your point.  If we can keep all of our assets, we should.  I just disagree with that premise based on the fact that there are 29 other teams that have historically shown they will do any and everything to make sure the Los Angeles Lakers don't rise again.  LeBron and PG13 or Cousins in LA is a nightmare.  If everyone is dismayed about GSW's dominance, they will be EXPONENTIALLY more upset about the Lakers being on top again.

 

If you think it's going to be as easy as "sit back and let the chips fall into place", respectfully and with no insult meant, you're wrong.  

 

I'd like everyone to remember DeAndre Jordan to the Mavs...all of those guys had already AGREED to come together and form a Super-Team in Dallas.  As soon as it was announced, the Clippers went BAT-POOP crazy and pulled out ALL of the stops to keep him there.  

 

That was for a C with little to no post game who is maybe a borderline AllStar.  We are talking about luring two of 3 of the 10 best players (arguably) in the game.  Competition won't be fierce...it will be "Game of Thrones - Red Wedding meets Battle at The Wall" all over the NBA.

 

The plan should be to keep together a group of guys that can win on their own and create the necessary spending power to add superstars to that. Getting a couple of stars will help us make a run in the short term, but keeping as many of the blue chippers as possible is key in winning both in the short and the long term and that should be the objective.

 

That's not the same as saying we shouldn't try to trade for a star. We just should give up too soon on a guy unless we can get someone that is willing to stay. All the guys we're looking to add are free agents, so giving up assets just to watch them possibly sign elsewhere isn't particularly smart.

 

Regarding Ingram, i think you are wrong. When we drafted him he was a project and when you take a young guy and throw him to the wolves, he's going to struggle. But he's followed the development curve that was expected and imo its too early to give up on him just because he isn't Ben Simmons (who is a more than a year older and much more physically mature).

 

Also, unless Westbrook gets a major injury or the Thunder fall off a cliff, they're not trading PG13. Cavs aren't trading Lebron either and i think the Pellies have to be FAR out of the playoffs for them to consider moving Boogie.


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#7540 LACAS

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Posted November 02, 2017 - 04:47 AM

Not that I disagree with either GCMD or Danish but regarding the current debate I have to lean with DLF... I think it would be premature to give up on Ingram; when he was drafted he was a total project and quite frankly still is but he has the tools and the desire to be who we hope to have drafted, in addition the new CBA will bite you sooner or later if you don't hold onto your youngsters, picks or if they don't pan out. Lastly I have a hard time giving up Ingram for a guy who will become a free agent this summer in hope that guy leads me to the other guy... just too many uncontrollable variables for me to gamble on... but what do I know.






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