662 replies to this topic

[DaSmoothOperator]

Why are people even still considering "tanking"...  While securing a draft pick is nice in that it holds value in the trade market, you also have to take into consideration the fact that it is a complete crap-shoot from the start.  The Lakers are in the point of the rebuild where they are still establishing a foundation around their young core.  For that reason, a winning record is more important because it will entice above average free agents to come.  While they likely won't land a star this offseason, the successes determined by this season will dictate what is to come.

 

This team has enough young pieces.  Clarkson, Russell, Ingram, Randle, Nance, and Zubac.  Even if they were to secure the pick, the most ideal route would be to package it for a borderline All-Star or whatever you can get in the market.

 

Luke and co. would never purposely try to lose games.  If you guys watch, the younger guys and entire squad is competing on a nightly basis.  Most nights they're capable of playing solid basketball and in the past 10 or so games, they've kept up with most teams and have even secured large leads.  They simply lack the killer instinct and consistency to close out games due to a variety of issues stemming from inexperience.

While I respect your point; I disagree, now as I've said ad naseum,  I don't advocate tanking but given the choice between the cannon fodder eighth seed and a pick I'll take the pick Not really a value in getting crushed hard, four times or are you an eternal optimist? I am a realist, didn't like the signings(Deng, Moz) so much but it's where we are. There isn't anyone coming that can change things this off season, mid level free agents aren't thirsting to play for the Lakers, not yet. It's gon be alright , it's gon be alright.

[lakerfan98]

Winning and experience matter.  Assets are always great but at some point real life comes into play.  Can't keep shuffling things around year after year.  

 

I know people don't actually believe this but it just sounds like the pro tanking fans think if we dump players we'll somehow automatically drop to 3rd-4th worst and definitely keep our pick.  Not factoring in there's a good chance that strategy could blow up in our face.  Hey, in a bubble sure I'd choose a high draft pick over players that won't be here in a year but since there is no guarantee of that I would choose to keep the team in tact and try to win as many games as possible.    

[kball]

A team fighting for 8th (and even during round 1 should they get there) may be increasing their players trade values though...so theres that.

 

Getting more in exchange for what we've got and are willing to deal away.

 

We've done really well through draft last 3 years.

Not so well in FA or trade (though lou will was a freaking' steal)

 

So maybe these next 2 years we do better in those 2 areas

[DaSmoothOperator]

I just checked and we'd pick 37th if it ended today, let's say we go to the playoffs that pick would drop even further,(40+) all for what the experience of going on the road, after 82 games? getting a beat-down isn't valuable experience in my book, not good enough to win and don't suck enough to improve? Land of mediocrity, no a thousand times no, let's just keep improving the individual players skill-sets and add what we can through the draft one more time. and BTW free agents aren't coming so put that to bed! I know how hard it is but we aren't the Clippers. I'll just be glad when this is over. 

Edited by DaSmoothOperator, January 10, 2017 - 02:04 PM.

[DanishLakerFan]

Winning and experience matter.  Assets are always great but at some point real life comes into play.  Can't keep shuffling things around year after year.  

 

I know people don't actually believe this but it just sounds like the pro tanking fans think if we dump players we'll somehow automatically drop to 3rd-4th worst and definitely keep our pick.  Not factoring in there's a good chance that strategy could blow up in our face.  Hey, in a bubble sure I'd choose a high draft pick over players that won't be here in a year but since there is no guarantee of that I would choose to keep the team in tact and try to win as many games as possible.    

 

Sure there is no guarantee that if we would have sold high on Swaggy, Lou (and perhaps Black and TRob) that we would be able to keep the pick, but we probably would have a bottom 3 record, which would give us close to a 50-50 shot at keeping the pick.

 

The top 3 guys in the 2017 draft are awesome and on par with the top 3 in recent years and Fultz in particular has superstar written all over him.

 

That's pretty much the situation in a nutshell:

 

I'm willing to gamble that

Whatever we can get back in a trade for those guys + a 50-50 chance of a top 3 pick (plus '19 pick back) would be FAR better for the Lakers long term, than whatever those guys bring right now. Worst case, the assets we get back wont pay off and we miss out on the pick. That would suck, of course, but we have no guarantee that Swaggy + TROb are here in 6 months and we have no guarantee that Lou-Black will be here 18 months from now.

 

Wont happen though.

[last stand 2.0]

I like our prospects overall more than Minnesota

Towns of course is the best one this is how I'd rank the prospects overall and I'll catch flack I'm sure

Towns
Ingram
Wiggins
Russell
Randle
Lavine

But here's the real kicker

I think outside of towns our prospects are more unselfish players. Ingram with all of his potential shares the ball, Russell likes to move the ball and suddenly randles mr. triple double machine

I've watched Minnesota a few times and I see a potential problem in that they are just not cohesive at all. Partly on the coach but Wiggins to me is on the fast track to one dimensional scorer. May change but that's where he's headed and without good coaching that's where he'll end up. Lavine is maybe slightly more willing to share, emphasis on slightly.

Towns is very unselfish, good ball player probably superstar down the road but I just don see the hype of the wolves as a whole

I think one of the perimeter guys will have to go

But the lakers look cohesive. And Ingram is so much more infant than anyone the wolves have and I see him exceeding Wiggins and lavine tbh

I see Russell being a more impactful player than Wiggins and lavine

And I see Randle being more impactful than lavine

Just how I see it tbh. I think we have the premium farm team right now.

[DanishLakerFan]

Guys this discussion will go nowhere. Go back and read the thread. Danish simply wants to tank and his mind is made up. Anybody that thinks Young and Lou will only add 5 more wins this season obviously hasn't been watching.

 

Have you read the title of the thread? It does seem like a decent place to discuss that sort of stuff, doesn't it. Not sure why you thing everyone has to agree all the time.

[kidpolean]

Have you read the title of the thread? It does seem like a decent place to discuss that sort of stuff, doesn't it. Not sure why you thing everyone has to agree all the time.

The title of the thread was dumb when it was created.

Would you rather be one of the bottom 3 teams in the league or make the playoffs...does that even sound like a logical question to you?

[last stand 2.0]

Unfortunately that's a legitimate question on this board now

[kidpolean]

Unfortunately that's a legitimate question on this board now

no it's not! Maybe if someone asked if we'd rather win 35 games or keep the pick but EVERY team in the NBA would easily choose playoffs over a top 3 pick.

[last stand 2.0]

no it's not! Maybe if someone asked if we'd rather win 35 games or keep the pick but EVERY team in the NBA would easily choose playoffs over a top 3 pick.

I mean it is a legitimate question on this board considering so many ask it

[DanishLakerFan]

The title of the thread was dumb when it was created.

Would you rather be one of the bottom 3 teams in the league or make the playoffs...does that even sound like a logical question to you?

 

Well, if that was the question i think the answer would be to make the playoffs, but it isn't. It may have started like that the first 20 games or so, but after the injuries and Swaggy P and Lou regressing to the mean (surprise, surprise) i think its more like end up winning 30 games and get the 8th worst record, or make a few moves and win 24 games for the bottom 3.

 

Not sure what is worst, Swaggy P signing elsewhere for maket value or Swaggy P signing with the Lakers for market value.

 

But it doesn't matter. Mitch wont go there and it may be too late.  

[BasketballIQ]

I think it's legit.

This is year 3 of a process but honestly year 1 of the rebuild.

MJ was the third overall pick so I can't diss that particular pick.


At the same time, this young group and few vets making the playoffs would be beautiful. So fun.

Imo W total means nothing much this season BC guys are still young.

And picking high always gives you a chance at a great player

[kidpolean]

Only on a Laker forum would fans rather be the worst team in the league than make the playoffs!

[LACAS]

O'Brien or bust!

[DaSmoothOperator]

no it's not! Maybe if someone asked if we'd rather win 35 games or keep the pick but EVERY team in the NBA would easily choose playoffs over a top 3 pick.

Sorry but I've seen this scenario before, long ago when there was real hoops being played, err, not this ESPN highlight BS, the fact of the matter is this team stinks for now and there's a limited upside, since one piece is out we fail. Nance is a solid player, Ingram still growing, Dlo is a combo guard but more of a two, With more assets we can have options to trade but the 37th pick common you are seriously thinking there's a value in just making the playoffs, I'm in it to win it. Thinking it would improve the players value nope they are who they are. Now I'd be happy for the 6th seed as then you have a slight chance but 8 no way no how. I have tennis shoes older than most folks on here. Which in itself just means I'm older. But long term assets are what counts, Boston will be there and If we don't get a decent pick I will say I told you so. Chick would be roasting this team for the lack of spirit and defense yes defense ever heard of it? And don't presume to speak for every team in the league. Smart GM's know to get out of the slaughterhouse they need players. Well back to reality. you may remember getting cranked in Texas as a crappy seed. If you can't beat em in the regular season why would you assume the games that matter would evoke some MONstars. BTW the only teams preferring that want the added ticket and tv revenue.

Edited by DaSmoothOperator, January 11, 2017 - 04:35 PM.

[DaSmoothOperator]

As a long time Laker Fan, I have seen the coaching carousel, the players with egos and poor practice habits and now finally a college team with no real purpose other than going one on one. If you didn't follow; the Blazers are the current eighth seed that we lost to ... again what is that 9 or 10 in a row?  There have been some fluke wins over quality teams but the playoffs you need four wins not a single fluke. 

sit down shut up and hold on.

[kidpolean]

What?

[Jody Smokes]

Last year sure.  I think plenty of teams would trade the playoffs for a guaranteed top 3 pick.  Adding young talent is never a bad thing.  It's just not something that you can stick with forever.  Which is why they added vets to the young guys this year.  

 

Only on a Laker forum would fans rather be the worst team in the league than make the playoffs!

[BasketballIQ]

Experience is valuable but another young player that has potential and can grow with this group isn't a bad thing.


That being said, I would not chase or prefer losses as a fan nor do I think the organization should.

If we add a C or SG that has potential and can compliment this style of play, you have something more valuable in the long run