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Another boom/bust year for Mitch and Buss regime


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#41 fido

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Posted September 28, 2016 - 10:10 PM

I don't know the future, can't be excited for something I (and nobody) can see.  I've been through this before, the whole young rebuilding thing, and it went nowhere previously.   All I can do is base it on my experience, and that's not favorable.  We'll see what happens, but excited for the future - no, not really.  I have no idea what it is.


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#42 RobBlake

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Posted September 28, 2016 - 10:24 PM

I just want our young guys to learn how to compete and up their in game iq

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#43 KidRN

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Posted September 28, 2016 - 10:40 PM

Then signing Mozgov was a waste of money, and with that I agree. Young teams like this, especially one with no definitive talent or leader lose in bunches. This team won' be 17 wins, but 25 is about the cap.

Yes, pissed. Losing ( and steady losing at that) should make you angry. If it doesn't then there's no amount of reason that will convince you otherwise.

The best C on our roster was a waste of money?

#44 BasketballIQ

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Posted September 28, 2016 - 11:43 PM

Rebuilding last time brought Shaq...

Young assets are never a bad thing. Especially ones that are good enough to be USA select Team participants.
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#45 Jody Smokes

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Posted September 29, 2016 - 06:15 AM

Base it on experience? LOL.  I assume you were around from the Showtime days.  If so you've only experienced 2 losing seasons outside of this rebuild.  93-94 and 04-05.  The rest of those years LA made the playoffs.  I think you should be more honest and say that you're a short sided fan that has 0 interest in the team UNLESS they are playing in the Finals or have Finals expecations. 

 

Just admit you're unreaslistic because there isn't a roster they could build in the last 3-4 years that didn't include Lebron, KD, CP3, Westbrook and a few others that would have netted them any kind of real contending hopes. 

 

I don't know the future, can't be excited for something I (and nobody) can see.  I've been through this before, the whole young rebuilding thing, and it went nowhere previously.   All I can do is base it on my experience, and that's not favorable.  We'll see what happens, but excited for the future - no, not really.  I have no idea what it is.


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"Blake and Parker are good at canceling each other out till our bench point guard comes in"  - Majesty aka Bird Ish (12/4/13)


#46 LACAS

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Posted September 29, 2016 - 08:13 AM

We have to hope the kids pan out in order to attract the stars that we have failed to get the past few summers, otherwise we will continue to whiff! That said I am excited for this season and I'm hoping the kids develop and surpass their expectations, if this happens we'll be good. If this doesnt happen, we are ______________. 

 

Im excited and I believe! 

 

Go Lakers!



#47 lakersince75

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Posted September 29, 2016 - 06:47 PM

We have to hope the kids pan out in order to attract the stars that we have failed to get the past few summers, otherwise we will continue to whiff! That said I am excited for this season and I'm hoping the kids develop and surpass their expectations, if this happens we'll be good. If this doesnt happen, we are ______________. 

 

Im excited and I believe! 

 

Go Lakers!

Exactly. We have to HOPE. Someone needs to have a break out season or surprise everyone. Its just funny how we have to hope when we had the #2 pick two years in a row. I look at Dunn and I see no doubt. I look at Okafor and I see no doubt barring health issues. I personally see Randle as a no doubt role player. He reminds me alot of AC Green. Love the dirty work if you can keep him from pretending he's a SF. There are alot of guys chosen in last years drafts that their respective teams don't have to hope and wish. I think the first 40 games will clear up alot of guessing for us



#48 Jody Smokes

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Posted September 29, 2016 - 08:13 PM

You're really just talking out of your ass at this point 

 

Exactly. We have to HOPE. Someone needs to have a break out season or surprise everyone. Its just funny how we have to hope when we had the #2 pick two years in a row. I look at Dunn and I see no doubt. I look at Okafor and I see no doubt barring health issues. I personally see Randle as a no doubt role player. He reminds me alot of AC Green. Love the dirty work if you can keep him from pretending he's a SF. There are alot of guys chosen in last years drafts that their respective teams don't have to hope and wish. I think the first 40 games will clear up alot of guessing for us


"Blake and Parker are good at canceling each other out till our bench point guard comes in"  - Majesty aka Bird Ish (12/4/13)


#49 fido

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Posted September 30, 2016 - 02:37 AM

I've gone off on others about this Jody, I guess you're next in line.

 

Don't assume you know who I am.  If I was that type of fan would I still be around?  Would I even bother? 

 

You want me to admit things that aren't what I think.  I contest the general lemming thinking about the Lakers because I'm honest and expect excellence at all times.  All - times.  I know this generation of fans is raised with less than stellar expectations of the Lakers, and for that there's no coming back.  If making the playoffs is what you count as a successful season then we can debate that over and over if you'd like.  Success equals winning the chip.  Anything less is a failure of a season.  Ask the big guys in the game how happy they are with making the playoffs or having a slight chance at getting out of the first round.  I can guarantee you they'll agree that your level of expectation and version of success is much different than theirs.

For once, just once (hopefully more, but all I can ask is that you show the smallest amount of consideration at this point), have some respect for those of us that have been Laker fans longer than you've been on this Earth,  Believe it or not, experience counts.

If some fans wanting and looking for excellence from the Lakers offends you, then ignore those posts and move on, it won't be a loss to me, others on here or yourself.  We'll learn to manage around each other.

 

And again, your veiled and not-so-veiled verbal attacks on others such as the above, "You're talking out of your ass at this point", are unacceptable.   I have yet to see anyone come at you the way you come at people.  I've told you this before.  If you feel the need to rebut an opinion, then do it without attacking someone with schoolyard insults.  It's unnecessary - as is thinking you know ANYTHING about anyone on this forum other than what you've seen them type.

I don't look forward to your insulting retort on this matter.  Go about your business, but if it's laced with insults, then I will issue you a final warning on the matter.


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#50 fido

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Posted September 30, 2016 - 02:51 AM

Basketball IQ:  Jerry West was around then to engineer room to acquire Shaq.  The young assets weren't dealt for anything of significance.   They were in effect let go to make more cap space to get Shaq to L.A.  They were, in effect, place holders until a big impact free agent was made available.  Along that line, I can't compare, in any way, shape, or form Jerry West's skill as a GM to Mitch and Jim's.  So that point really holds no water to this current situation.

In a perfect world all young players on the Lakers work out to great levels.  But in a realistic world, that won't happen.  It's fine to be optimistic about it, but with cautioun and a regard to the history of young players on developing teams.  What is silly to me is to me bleary-eyed about the future of young players simply because they wear the purple and gold.  Cautious optimism is reasonable to me, but I have yet to see that on this forum.  The pie in the sky dream scenarios I read here often feel foolish at best.

 

And yes, a recently injured and often expendable Mozgov as your out-of-the-gate 12:01 free agent grab is a silly expenditure of the cap room management has so coveted.  Black, Zubac, Randle (and now the other bizarre signing, Jianlian) would've been just fine as a center rotation.  It's not like I'm the only person who thought this was a monumental error.  I hope it's proven wrong, but his history, as well as the history of big men on the decline sends up far too many red flags for me.  I guess the ill-fated Hibbert experiment (that all ardent Hibbert supporters here never admitted their error to) has already been forgotten.


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#51 kball

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Posted September 30, 2016 - 04:19 AM

I view the Mozgov signing a bit like letting the wife or gf go a bit crazy while shopping and privately shaking your head while realizing its not the worst thing.

 

Fair to say Mozgov won't be in the way of any of our youngins development except maybe Zubac.

So a defensive anchor who doesn't need a lot of shots makes a lot of sense to me.

And if we have a younger faster lineup that gels together, or Zubac comes on quicker than expected, he can be traded at some point.

 

Not sure if this is true but Bresnahan was reporting/claiming on that media day show that privately the FO is looking for 30-35 wins.

 

I'd be giddy at 35. And pleased w 32ish


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Excited for  1. Lebron! (Still love me some Kobe, but damn this guy is amazing) 2. Another big get (Whether in FA or in a trade we need some attractions and closers) 3. Young Guys making big jump (Assuming we have anyone left after more necessary moves either genius ones or in desperation)

READY FOR SEASON!!!

 

 


#52 LACAS

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Posted September 30, 2016 - 04:38 AM

Exactly. We have to HOPE. Someone needs to have a break out season or surprise everyone. Its just funny how we have to hope when we had the #2 pick two years in a row. I look at Dunn and I see no doubt. I look at Okafor and I see no doubt barring health issues. I personally see Randle as a no doubt role player. He reminds me alot of AC Green. Love the dirty work if you can keep him from pretending he's a SF. There are alot of guys chosen in last years drafts that their respective teams don't have to hope and wish. I think the first 40 games will clear up alot of guessing for us

 

HOPE is everything, with every season, with every player and with every pick, it starts with hope that everyone stays healthy.  

 

Having the #2 pick two years in a row was great but whether you have the 1st, 2nd, 3rd... it doesn't guarantee anyone anything, Dunn looked solid in SL, Okafor hasn't impressed me much, he is still the same player he was at Duke; an offensive big who plays zero D... It says something that the kid was shopped his rookie year and continues to be shopped... Lets also keep in mind hindsight is 20/20.

 

As for Randle, Ive never been sold on him, I need to see a lot more than "bully-ball", if Julius can slow it down, stay in control and develop a mid range game he could be special... TBD.

 

I like Russell, Clarkson and Ingram; I think DLo will be a very good PG in the association, I tend to think something like Conley, nothing flashy, simply consistently good. If JC continues to improve his O and focuses on D he will be a very solid starter! Ingram will be special, if he were 20-25lbs heavier I would say he would be special this year which he still may be... patience. I think the LAL have done well with the picks, time will tell.

 

I don't disagree with you, I guess Im simply more hopeful hahaha.... Go Lakers! 


Edited by LACAS, September 30, 2016 - 08:13 AM.


#53 LACAS

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Posted September 30, 2016 - 04:44 AM

I view the Mozgov signing a bit like letting the wife or gf go a bit crazy while shopping and privately shaking your head while realizing its not the worst thing.

 

Fair to say Mozgov won't be in the way of any of our youngins development except maybe Zubac.

So a defensive anchor who doesn't need a lot of shots makes a lot of sense to me.

And if we have a younger faster lineup that gels together, or Zubac comes on quicker than expected, he can be traded at some point.

 

Not sure if this is true but Bresnahan was reporting/claiming on that media day show that privately the FO is looking for 30-35 wins.

 

I'd be giddy at 35. And pleased w 32ish

RE: Mozgov... Pretty much on point.

 

I may be a fool but I don't think 35 is far fetched... I truly don't think we got to the best out of our kids last season, I believe they should thrive under Luke's offense and I also like the Deng singing.  



#54 Jody Smokes

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Posted September 30, 2016 - 06:51 AM

Why do you always feel like someone is insulting you?  I haven't said anything outright negative about you or your character.  Everything I said about you is in the context of the how you think as a fan of the team or teambuilding in general. 

 

I've gone off on others about this Jody, I guess you're next in line.

 

Don't assume you know who I am.  If I was that type of fan would I still be around?  Would I even bother? 

 

You want me to admit things that aren't what I think.  I contest the general lemming thinking about the Lakers because I'm honest and expect excellence at all times.  All - times.  I know this generation of fans is raised with less than stellar expectations of the Lakers, and for that there's no coming back.  If making the playoffs is what you count as a successful season then we can debate that over and over if you'd like.  Success equals winning the chip.  Anything less is a failure of a season.  Ask the big guys in the game how happy they are with making the playoffs or having a slight chance at getting out of the first round.  I can guarantee you they'll agree that your level of expectation and version of success is much different than theirs.

For once, just once (hopefully more, but all I can ask is that you show the smallest amount of consideration at this point), have some respect for those of us that have been Laker fans longer than you've been on this Earth,  Believe it or not, experience counts.

If some fans wanting and looking for excellence from the Lakers offends you, then ignore those posts and move on, it won't be a loss to me, others on here or yourself.  We'll learn to manage around each other.

 

And again, your veiled and not-so-veiled verbal attacks on others such as the above, "You're talking out of your ass at this point", are unacceptable.   I have yet to see anyone come at you the way you come at people.  I've told you this before.  If you feel the need to rebut an opinion, then do it without attacking someone with schoolyard insults.  It's unnecessary - as is thinking you know ANYTHING about anyone on this forum other than what you've seen them type.

I don't look forward to your insulting retort on this matter.  Go about your business, but if it's laced with insults, then I will issue you a final warning on the matter.


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#55 JGuez

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Posted September 30, 2016 - 07:36 AM

I don't know the future, can't be excited for something I (and nobody) can see.  I've been through this before, the whole young rebuilding thing, and it went nowhere previously.   All I can do is base it on my experience, and that's not favorable.  We'll see what happens, but excited for the future - no, not really.  I have no idea what it is.

 

I find it shocking that you can't look at something and even have a feeling if it will be good or not. You don't need to know for a fact if this young core will be great one day or not but you can sure as hell have a belief that they may be one way or the other.

 

Ironically trying to predict the future is part of what building a professional sports team is all about whether you're drafting, signing contracts and even creating cap space for future seasons.

 

It doesn't even need to be basketball. When the first iPhone was announced many people looked at that and believed "That's the future of phones". No one had to bet their life on it, but they could look at that and say "I think that's where this tech is going and that is going to succeed". 

 

Same thing applies to the Lakers. Personally I can look at this team and say "I think where this team is going is the right direction and it is going to succeed". I hope I'm not proven wrong for the sake of our team but I'm not afraid to come out and say that guess if I feel it's right. I'd say it the other way if I felt it was the wrong direction for us.

 

Maybe I'm just used to running a business where I have to make plans for the future on a daily basis....


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#56 LACAS

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Posted September 30, 2016 - 08:12 AM

You're really just talking out of your ass at this point 

 

This isn't even physically possible ;)


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#57 lakerfan98

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Posted September 30, 2016 - 10:46 AM

Why do you always feel like someone is insulting you?  I haven't said anything outright negative about you or your character.  Everything I said about you is in the context of the how you think as a fan of the team or teambuilding in general. 

 

Even with the obstacles the Lakers have faced in recent years to read Fido's posts you'd think if Dr. Buss and Jerry West were still here we'd still be at the top.  If there were more fans like him we wouldn't be where we are now.  Which goes back to your point the other day about well if so and so were here he wouldn't put up with this losing like that's something that can be controlled solely by a mentality lol.  Just win baby is fine when you've actually got the players to do it.  What about West's tenure with the Grizzlies?  Pat Riley post LeBron?

 

When I was on the ESPN boards before I came here there were people who thought the Chris Paul veto didn't matter.  We're the Lakers we'll just get the next guy, whatever, etc.  This mentality that because the Lakers had been successful they'd continue to be successful ad infinitum simply because they're the Lakers.  Fans who were spoiled rotten by decades of success and actually began to think that the sport, league, team owed them something.  Losing is for the other 29 teams we're different, we're special, we're the Lakers.  We're soon to be on the 4th CBA since we landed Shaq 20 years ago.  Time to let that go because it isn't remotely relevant anymore.  In 2016 the Lakers are just another team and we have to build our team the way everyone else does.  There are shortcuts but attempting one is more likely to lead to a mid 2000s Knicks situation than a return to glory.  The league has changed and so have the Lakers.  Some fans on the other hand.....                  


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#58 bigvee

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Posted September 30, 2016 - 11:05 AM

Well, I guess you can complain about everything going on about a sports team because they're not winning.

 

Or you can save yourself the stress of negativity and try to look on the bright side of things. We're young. We're seemingly moving in the right direction. We have a few players who have the potential to be stars one day. Almost every player we have is on a reasonable contract and locked in for a long time. 

 

There really aren't many teams that can say all that. 

Being critical of a sports team does nothing if they're still profitable like the Lakers are. They brought in a new coach with young and exciting talent (to some), meaning that ticket sales aren't really gonna take a huge hit. Merchandise is gonna be through the roof because there are so many new faces to advertise.

 

Look at a team like the Hawks, who have contended in the East for a couple years now, but can't even fill up seats in a playoff game. A franchise like that actually cares about fan support. The Lakers are locked in, they don't worry too much about all this uproar.



#59 lakersince75

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Posted September 30, 2016 - 03:52 PM

You're really just talking out of your ass at this point 

You're entitled to your opinion and time will tell



#60 lakersince75

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Posted September 30, 2016 - 04:26 PM

I appreciate your thoughts. I've been watching BBall for about 40 years. The thing that bothers me is people are pissed because I don't see anything special other than Ingram. He's different. I understand the Randle comment but could you imagine if he focus strictly on D and rebounding. Beast!!  I will continue to voice my gut feelings no matter what some [expletive] feels about it. Im not cool with what's been happening the last 4 years and the fact that it looks like this roster at best will be average in about 3 years. As a REAL Laker fan THIS SUCKS. Optimism is cool but Im a realist and I want better. I am not cool with sucking for 7 seven years. I have more Laker pride than that. Here is where it gets crazy; I can see this roster being much better than last year. At the same time I feel even in 3 years there is a glass ceiling that isn't too high. I have no beef with what you've said due to it being respectful. Its these other Pr*@ks (that haven't been right about much) being disrespectful as if they know anything other than what they can Google. It's funny; alot of people come down on me because I like Okafor. But at the end of the day he was better than Russell last year. It's funny how we are willing to give Russell and his sorry defense and turnovers a break for the next 3 years but we don't think Okafor's defense will get better EVER. We talk about Okafor being shopped. They have 3 or 4 VERY good centers on their team. Russell was in trade talks also and our pgs are Calderon and Huertas.  It an effin Joke

HOPE is everything, with every season, with every player and with every pick, it starts with hope that everyone stays healthy.  

 

Having the #2 pick two years in a row was great but whether you have the 1st, 2nd, 3rd... it doesn't guarantee anyone anything, Dunn looked solid in SL, Okafor hasn't impressed me much, he is still the same player he was at Duke; an offensive big who plays zero D... It says something that the kid was shopped his rookie year and continues to be shopped... Lets also keep in mind hindsight is 20/20.

 

As for Randle, Ive never been sold on him, I need to see a lot more than "bully-ball", if Julius can slow it down, stay in control and develop a mid range game he could be special... TBD.

 

I like Russell, Clarkson and Ingram; I think DLo will be a very good PG in the association, I tend to think something like Conley, nothing flashy, simply consistently good. If JC continues to improve his O and focuses on D he will be a very solid starter! Ingram will be special, if he were 20-25lbs heavier I would say he would be special this year which he still may be... patience. I think the LAL have done well with the picks, time will tell.

 

I don't disagree with you, I guess Im simply more hopeful hahaha.... Go Lakers! 


Edited by bigfetz, September 30, 2016 - 07:13 PM.

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