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Julius Randle: Fit & Potential

Julius Randle fit potential trade

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#21 FranklinPeanuts

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Posted May 31, 2016 - 07:32 PM

See Z-Bo...and he was an AllStar...borderline Franchise player also.


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#22 GCMD

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Posted May 31, 2016 - 07:33 PM

Thank you

 

 

Anytime...how quickly people forget...


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#23 FranklinPeanuts

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Posted May 31, 2016 - 07:35 PM

https://www.youtube....h?v=xEH4u5M2UIA

This is how Randle should be used...it's where he'd be most efficient and help the TEAM. It's also not what this offense is about:

https://www.youtube....h?v=nLUAo1Z7Cio


That would be a nice role for J.R.. I would even accept him bringing the ball from time to time.. feed him on the block and let him go to work.

#24 GCMD

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Posted May 31, 2016 - 07:54 PM

That would be a nice role for J.R.. I would even accept him bringing the ball from time to time.. feed him on the block and let him go to work.

 

 

Would be great for him.  Allows him to use his speed and strength to carve out space BEFORE he gets the ball, not try to drive thru players all of the time.  Problem is, Luke would have to alter the offense to run flares and screens through the mid/low block towards Randle or have Randle start high and set a down screen...that's where Randle gets lost.

 

His court awareness and feel for the game without the ball is non-existent.  If he doesn't have the ball in his hands or isn't setting an on-ball screen, he's watching the ball.

 

What does that mean?  He's going to get lost in this offense as much OR MORE than the Princeton...

 

 

Because guess what?  Kerr's offense USES Princeton Principles!  LOL...


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#25 DanishLakerFan

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Posted May 31, 2016 - 07:58 PM

Since every thread turns into a "does Julius Randle fit" thread at some point, I decided to start a thread just for that...

 

 

Does Randle fit the roster?

Does Randle fit the offense?

 

Can Randle change?

 

Did Byron cause Randle's tendencies?

 

Here are some videos to get us started...


 

This is the offense people want to try to shoehorn Randle in...

 

This is the guy people want to TRANSFORM Randle into:



 

Discuss...

 

I was getting quite tired of those ridiculous rainbow colored rants of yours because they were getting a bit too condescending for my taste, but i suppose i'll have another go at it.

 

Not a "die-hard" at all and i never said that Randle would become an all-star in a GS-type system, but this is the whole problem with your take on Randle.

 

I'll try to make it short, btw.

 

1. No-one knows exactly what type of offense we'll run or how Randle will be used. Good coaches always try to find a way for your players to be effective - even if they dont fit exactly into the primary scheme (except for MDA of course) and i expect Luke to do the same. 

 

2. Ability to improve. Most guys take big leaps forward in the first couple of years they're in the league and improve their shooting, defense and overall game, so to completely shoehorn Randle as a rigid NBA-stereotype who cant ever be taught a different approach, is strange. Personally, i dont know what he'll be, but i do like some of the skills he has at that size and i think a good coach can make him a lot better and find a role for him.

 

Also, the final words of the last video you posted about how we'll play - at about 11.07 - the guy says: 

"My point is this: players can be taught how to play this way and they can be taught how to play this way in a very short period of time. This gonna be a fun year"

I agree.

 

3. Value on the market. Even if i agreed with you on Randle's fit, i think moving him for something significant is going to be difficult. There are a few interesting upsidey PF prospects in the top 10-12 range in the draft, so we likely wont get a good pick and for the next two summers the cap explodes and everyone will be able to add players via free agency. At the same time he has too much upside just to give away for a lesser talent / veteran. We could easily find that in free agency, if necessary. Therefore, i would roll the dice with Randle - and his 3M/yr deal - and spend my money on a defensive wing and a defensive 5 and roll from there.

 

I'm done.


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#26 BasketballIQ

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Posted May 31, 2016 - 08:17 PM

Randle will ruin this franchise with his ball hogging

#27 GCMD

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Posted May 31, 2016 - 08:38 PM

DL

 

Since you don't like the Rainbow, I'll see what I can do about that...(LOL)

 

 

You could make a case for any player in the league becoming a great player in the league if they changed this or added that...it doesn't work that way.

 

 

Like I said earlier:

 

I'd bet dollars to doughnuts that Nance has a better chance to become a similar player to LO and Simmons than Randle and it's not even close.

 

 

See, this guy excites me.  He plays off the ball, sets screens, rolls and finishes.  If you want to play the "what if" game, why not do it with him?  

 

What if Nance develops a 3 point shot?

What if Nance works on his passing (which isn't bad)?

What if Nance works on his handles (which aren't bad)?

 

He's already a GREAT FIT to the offense...EVERYBODY found Nance and even BYRON saw that Nance was a better option to start over Randle...

 

 

So "what if" Nance developed as much as Randle?  OR MORE!?

 

 

See...that's the slippery slope.  You assume Randle WILL work on those things that could make him a better fit or change things about his tendencies or develop things like court awareness, passing or outside shooting he doesn't have because that's what you WANT to believe.  ANYONE could pick ANYBODY in the NBA and do the same...it would be no more valid.  You can't keep saying "what if" or "no one knows".  You have to operate on common sense and extrapolate based on what IS, not what you want.


Edited by GCMD, May 31, 2016 - 08:42 PM.

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#28 BasketballIQ

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Posted May 31, 2016 - 09:07 PM

Randle is younger.
Nance is a second generation player.

He should be more developed.

#29 GCMD

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Posted May 31, 2016 - 09:12 PM

Randle is younger.
Nance is a second generation player.

He should be more developed.

 

 

More developed isn't the same as fully developed or finished developing...and you completely missed the point of my post, as usual.


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#30 BasketballIQ

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Posted May 31, 2016 - 09:13 PM

They both will likely improve. Randle has more upside.

Edited by BasketballIQ, May 31, 2016 - 09:13 PM.


#31 GCMD

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Posted May 31, 2016 - 09:15 PM

They both will likely improve. Randle has more upside.

 

 

Nance is 23 (1/1)

Randle will be 22 on 11/25...13 months difference.

 

You were saying?


Edited by GCMD, May 31, 2016 - 09:16 PM.

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#32 DanishLakerFan

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Posted May 31, 2016 - 10:08 PM

DL

 

Since you don't like the Rainbow, I'll see what I can do about that...(LOL)

 

 

I hate rainbows. And unicorns.

 

No one cares who can become more similar to Simmons or LO between Randle and Nance, because that is irrelevant. I'll repeat my post that you conveniently ignore (again), amigo.

1. We dont know exactly what type of offense will be run, or Randle's role in it.

2. Guys in their early 20s, rookies/sophohmore  historically does improve and you have yet to provide a valid argument as to why Randle is one of the very few 21 y/o players who wont be able to improve.

3. Even if we wanted to trade him, we wont get fair value and since a starting caliber PF is going to cost us 10+M i think keeping Randle on his 3M is the smart move.



#33 Tensai

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Posted June 01, 2016 - 12:39 AM

*facepalm*

21 year old player with a body of a veteran. Averaging 10.2 rpg (13.1 per36) in basically his rookie year.

What do you really want to see from a player who was selected from #7? Average 20-10 and 3 assists? I'm one of those who pointed out the Simmons - Randle fit issues but singling out Randle is foolish. He is a talented young player that has yet to find his place in NBA. Any comparison is meaningless, be it Zach Randolph, Draymond Green or Lamar Odom. When it is all said and done, he is going to be remembered as Julius Randle doing what he does best. It is too early to give up on him because of some stupid expectations.
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#34 erfolk

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Posted June 01, 2016 - 01:11 AM

Danish
Maj
erfolk

These guys are diehards...they think Randle can LEARN to play like Green and Simmons...real talk.

Clutch is close...but I think he is just afraid of getting rid of him, not delusional about his potential and game.

When did I ever say he would be Simmons or Green? I'll wait. I have said that I m still not sold on Randle. Don't make things up about me please when you have nothing to back it up.

Edited by erfolk, June 01, 2016 - 01:16 AM.


#35 Bishop*

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Posted June 01, 2016 - 04:16 AM

I call shenanigans...

 

 

Vacuum...yes.  But we are talking about his affect on the rest of the team.  This offense will do the OPPOSITE of showcasing Randle's talents or raising his trade value.  His value won't get higher by him struggling in an offense that does NOT feature him...and NO ONE expects him to pick this offense up quickly...

 

If you had an offense that revolved around back-to-the-basket scoring, would you have Lamar Odom as your #1 post option?  No...doesn't make sense.  You COULD make a case for LO bulking up and getting stronger but do you think that you could change LO into a bruiser?

 

No...just like you're not going to change Randle into system guy who plays off the ball, sets picks for everyone else and doesn't worry about taking over the game by himself...it doesn't work that way.

 

Kobe and Phil tried to turn Pau into a bruiser...LOL...

 

What I keep wondering is how you are so sure about the accession you make. I am not saying Randle will for sure do that also but we have seen guys come into this league and added a lot to their games after a couple years so for you  to be so sure that Randle cannot and will never be willing to set picks is very interesting. 



#36 Bishop*

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Posted June 01, 2016 - 04:20 AM

Yep...if you want to drive his trade value lower, sure.

 

 

Again it is written in stone that his trade value will go down. There is no chance it might rise in a good offense. Hope you can see it in your own post. 



#37 BasketballIQ

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Posted June 01, 2016 - 04:23 AM

GCMD claimed Odom wouldn't win a title here. Longer rants
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#38 JayTheGreat

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Posted June 01, 2016 - 04:24 AM

I mean bottom line is that Simmons excels at the things Randle fails at. So if by the luck of the draw we get Simmons and he doesn't gel with Randle then you know who has to go.

#39 Bishop*

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Posted June 01, 2016 - 04:42 AM

And we are talking about a guy who found a way to play in the post in College when he was tasked to do that. All of a sudden people are thinking that is his only identity. Bully ball player. someone should show me any Randle highlight in high school where he was playing bully ball. He started playing that way in college when he was being turned into a post player. He found a way to make it work. That also came with the ball sticking when it got to him because as a post player the ball stick when it comes to you. 

 

This is a guy who was able to reinvent himself in college when he needed to do that. I am not saying Randle is going to be a superstar. All I am trying to say is we don't have to be quick to count him out. 



#40 DanishLakerFan

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Posted June 01, 2016 - 04:47 AM

I mean bottom line is that Simmons excels at the things Randle fails at. So if by the luck of the draw we get Simmons and he doesn't gel with Randle then you know who has to go.

I dont think anyone disagree that Randle is the lesser talent between him and Simmons and if we do land Simmons i  expect us to check the market and if something presents itself we likely would pull the trigger. But if that "something" is Arron Afflalo or some other dime-a-dozen halv-decent veteran rotation player i'd rather keep Randle and bring him in as the back-up 4/5 and perhaps try to increase his trade value.


Edited by DanishLakerFan, June 01, 2016 - 04:48 AM.






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