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How different would the Lakers be if Dwight stayed?


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#21 ajaxjs

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Posted May 26, 2014 - 09:08 PM

Dwight who?

 

I'll give a legit response, just for the hell of it.

 

Which is: It's not even worth thinking about. The time spent writing and reading this post and thread will be wasted. That whole 'STAY' campaign was just embarassing (from the viewpoint of a Los Angeles native sports fan interacting with other team fandoms in a non-sympathetic work environment, anyways). Dwight was overrated when we signed him, and he was overrated when he left.

 

Did every fan with a heart nurse some tentative hope that Nash+Howard would be some killer combo? Of course. But I doubt you could find many serious Laker fans who would want Dwight on our team, even if we knew he'd be playing for us, like he is for the Rockets (which isn't that great. His rebound avg is among the most inflated in the league, when you compare contested vs uncontested rebounds...remember that Bynum-esque pissy look he'd get whenever Steve Blake jumped up and snatched the easy ones?).

 

Dwight's time in LA is a farcial blip that we're lucky lasted only one season. I'm glad both him and Bynum are gone. And this is coming from a fan that had a Shaq jersey in the 90's. I'd love to see another dominant big man with a personality. But Bynum and Howard are just the pits. One is an idiot-savant (Bynum and his beautiful f/cking mind...go be an engineer or whatever your dream was, you sullen douchebag, after getting 3 East Coast fanbases in 18 months to hate you for spoiling their locker room chemistry) and the other desperately obnoxious in the manner of a little kid whose parents are separated and is badly attention starved. 

 

The only 'What If' worth dwelling on with any kind of pathos is the CP3 deal. In ten or twenty years, people will still be debating that historic screwjob. In 2044, when we're reading Old Jimmy's demented Sterling-esque rants taped from down at the race track on our retinal interface while hovering to work on our rocket boots, there's going to be a thread mentioning the nixed CP3 deal right under the one about the first woman to dunk in the NBA. Probably raised whenever the Clippers passing us in championships is spoken of. And noone will give a [expletive] about Dwight, beyond being the subject of an extremely difficult trivia question. You and I will have forgotten his name.


Edited by ajaxjs, May 26, 2014 - 09:26 PM.

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#22 KobeWillReturnTriumphant

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Posted May 26, 2014 - 09:11 PM

What if Robert Horry had never retired and was still shooting three point shots?  What if Randy Pfund had only had a better chance to prove his coaching prowess.  If only Kareem had never hung up his jersey.  Hypotheticals are all good, but the sooner we stop talking about Dwight leaving, the better things are.  The future is bright with Dwight 2.0 (Robert Sacre).



#23 Majesty

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Posted May 26, 2014 - 09:15 PM

If Dwight stayed and we were able to get our bench. We'd have the same team we had this year but with Dwight and with Pau amnestied.  

 

Under those circumstances we probably make the playoffs and have a super deep bench and interior points not scored so easily on us and Jordan Hill probably starts indefinitely because there's no more Pau. 

 

Kobe is able to come back gingerly and probably takes longer off because we wouldn't be fighting for .500 and likely returns by January or for the Christmas game.  

We make the playoffs likely around where the Warriors are if Kobe took time off and face the Clippers with a healthy Kobe, Dwight and the 2nd best bench in the league. 

Would have gotten further than the first round if Kobe and Dwight remained healthy.  


Unfortunately we'll never know, but I will tell you one thing, Dwight's legacy would have been enhanced because considering the deep team he'd have had around him we'd have won more games in Kobe's absence and Lakers fans would have gravitated more to the idea of it being Dwight's team eventually and his stock goes way up in the media eye.

D'antoni is still fired this off-season.   


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"Bryant had come to rage against the idea that Howard's clownish disposition could overtake the locker room, the Lakers' culture, and had warned Howard that he would never, ever let it happen." 


#24 fido

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Posted May 26, 2014 - 09:18 PM

D'Antoni would've still been the coach - nothing but bad would've come from it.
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#25 -Wade-

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Posted May 26, 2014 - 09:22 PM

This year? Probably the same, first round exit at best (being nice). Look at our record.


0iNkSmB.jpg

 

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#26 ajaxjs

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Posted May 26, 2014 - 09:29 PM

As some have mentioned, it is worth pointing out that if D'Antoni was still coaching Dwight, his shoulder probably would have fallen off by now. He'd be in the ICU with Kobe and Nash. Just like every other player over thirty years of age that D'Antoni gets his hands on. He even busted Metta's knee. I'd say he wrecked Pau, but it was more like Team Spain.


Carmelo Anthony barely survived D'Antoni's tenure in NY. D'Antoni's career is littered with the bleached bones of unfortunate NBA players. He's the Fifth Horseman. Hell, D'Antoni broke his own leg, just being in his own radius. (And isn't it nice when a coach explains his poor performance in the first half of a season, by describing the gnarly pain killers he was on for most of December and January?)


Edited by ajaxjs, May 26, 2014 - 09:34 PM.

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#27 Icker

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Posted May 26, 2014 - 09:51 PM

The Lakers still will be bad., except with an even more broken Dwight. Not even a prime Kareem could of willed this roster to .500.

#28 EJ06

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Posted May 27, 2014 - 12:10 AM

A year later and it's easy to see Howard made the right move. MDA would have driven him into the ground just like Kobe.



#29 CueTheRain

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Posted May 27, 2014 - 05:28 AM

As some have mentioned, it is worth pointing out that if D'Antoni was still coaching Dwight, his shoulder probably would have fallen off by now. He'd be in the ICU with Kobe and Nash. Just like every other player over thirty years of age that D'Antoni gets his hands on. He even busted Metta's knee. I'd say he wrecked Pau, but it was more like Team Spain.


Carmelo Anthony barely survived D'Antoni's tenure in NY. D'Antoni's career is littered with the bleached bones of unfortunate NBA players. He's the Fifth Horseman. Hell, D'Antoni broke his own leg, just being in his own radius. (And isn't it nice when a coach explains his poor performance in the first half of a season, by describing the gnarly pain killers he was on for most of December and January?)

Your analysis is pure gold. Please don't stop. (not being sarcastic)


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#30 Jody Smokes

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Posted May 27, 2014 - 07:31 AM

I didn't even to read the initial post after a few lines but I'll say if Dwight had stayed and bought into the coaching and team they could have done well if Kobe had come back and stayed healthy and done the same.  Don't think they would have been true contenders but they could have been a mid level seed for sure.  Dwight and Kobe on paper could have done damage but no one wanted to give anything.  Sad to say it didn't work out for fans.  

 

Dwight didn't want to pick and roll, mostly probably due to his ego and wanting to prove he's a great post threat (he is to a degree but should work to his strengths)

 

Pau did not want play mid post and high post, he was dangerous when they ran HORNS sets.  Defensively he was an issue but they could have worked around that possibly

 

Kobe, well Kobe is Kobe.  He's stubborn, regardless of you agree he could have bent a bit and been a bit more patient with everything.  Making comments about Dwight's injuries and telling Pau to put his big boy pants on while he was probably the worst defender on the team for most of year was out of line.

 

Nash...pretty unfortunate altogether.


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#31 Windu

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Posted May 27, 2014 - 08:34 AM

if Dwight had stayed and bought into the coaching and team they could have done well if Kobe had come back and stayed healthy and done the same.

 

Which coaching are you referring to?


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#32 David

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Posted May 27, 2014 - 08:41 AM

You guys are in denial. We lost the best center in the league. A center as Dwight's caliber is hard to find. We failed him by hiring the most pathetic coach possible.


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#33 epicwolf

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Posted May 27, 2014 - 09:57 AM

10 more wins probably not much.   MDA doesnt know how to use big man so you can have Shaq and Kareem at their prime on the same team and MDA will probably bench both of them so he can play his "system"


Edited by epicwolf, May 27, 2014 - 09:58 AM.


#34 Jody Smokes

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Posted May 27, 2014 - 10:17 AM

Doesn't really matter who the coach was if players aren't buying in. 

 

 

Which coaching are you referring to?


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#35 KobeWillReturnTriumphant

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Posted May 27, 2014 - 10:40 AM

You guys are in denial. We lost the best center in the league. A center as Dwight's caliber is hard to find. We failed him by hiring the most pathetic coach possible.

I would argue the faliure to meet obligations went both ways.  MDA sucked.  But it isn't like Dwight went out of his way to embrace being a Laker...or play to the needs of the team.  The best center in the league shouldn't take nights off, complain about touches, or be shooting fifteen foot jumpshots (when he has no business doing so). 



#36 Jody Smokes

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Posted May 27, 2014 - 10:44 AM

I agree, but it doesn't all fall on Dwight.  MDA is a poor communicator as far as dealing with personalities.  That's his biggest issue and why he isn't fit to coach superstars IMO.  His offensive philosophies aren't his issue seeing that other coaches like Pop have praised his schemes.  Dwight, Kobe and Pau all didn't want to bend on something or another which we can point out but until blame is spread evenly this conversation won't get far.  Embracing being a Laker?  What does that even mean?  That's fan talk.  You embrace balling out to the best of your ability and doing what it takes for the team to succeed.  None of them did that last year until it was too late. 

 

 

I would argue the faliure to meet obligations went both ways.  MDA sucked.  But it isn't like Dwight went out of his way to embrace being a Laker...or play to the needs of the team.  The best center in the league shouldn't take nights off, complain about touches, or be shooting fifteen foot jumpshots (when he has no business doing so). 


Edited by Jody Smokes, May 27, 2014 - 10:45 AM.

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#37 Majesty

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Posted May 27, 2014 - 01:43 PM

Yes, and Metta even said that they came into the year with the wrong mentality that they could turn it on cause they had so much more talent and took advantage of D'antoni and even Mike Brown. Metta doesn't say things for no reason. They didn't buy in cause they felt they'd win at a high clip anyway, the 'rome wasn't built in a day' mentality that would have worked with learning the Princeton stayed through D'antoni.

When you got Dwight caring leSs about winning and more about getting post ups and working on his post game in games instead of practice, Pau complaining despite being lethal in horns, and even this year complaining about D'antoni's style whem he had a 17/9 year at only 31 mins played compare to the 37 he'd usually play to get that shows how right Metta was. Everyone had an agenda and was focused more on it than winning till it was too late. That's on everyone.
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"Bryant had come to rage against the idea that Howard's clownish disposition could overtake the locker room, the Lakers' culture, and had warned Howard that he would never, ever let it happen." 


#38 ajaxjs

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Posted May 27, 2014 - 01:46 PM

Yes, and Metta even said that they came into the year with the wrong mentality that they could turn it on cause they had so much more talent and took advantage of D'antoni and even Mike Brown. Metta doesn't say things for no reason. They didn't buy in cause they felt they'd win at a high clip anyway, the 'rome wasn't built in a day' mentality that would have worked with learning the Princeton stayed through D'antoni.

When you got Dwight caring leSs about winning and more about getting post ups and working on his post game in games instead of practice, Pau complaining despite being lethal in horns, and even this year complaining about D'antoni's style whem he had a 17/9 year at only 31 mins played compare to the 37 he'd usually play to get that shows how right Metta was. Everyone had an agenda and was focused more on it than winning till it was too late. That's on everyone.

 

Glad you mentioned Metta. He's given some great interviews and statements about his last couple seasons with the Lakers, if anyone is genuinely interested in getting a glimpse of what was going on, that's not been through a PR filter.



#39 EJ06

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Posted May 27, 2014 - 02:48 PM

I would argue the faliure to meet obligations went both ways.  MDA sucked.  But it isn't like Dwight went out of his way to embrace being a Laker...or play to the needs of the team.  The best center in the league shouldn't take nights off, complain about touches, or be shooting fifteen foot jumpshots (when he has no business doing so). 

 

I hated Dwight complaining about touches, but it was fairly clear Kobe wasn't going give up the ball in the last four minutes. It's frustrating and that style of play ended up costing the team a playoff run. Look at Howard vs Portland. He looked unstoppable. Point is: if MDA and Kobe were willing to play through Howard once in a while when the game was on the line, maybe he wouldn't have felt like a glorified role player.



#40 Windu

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Posted May 27, 2014 - 05:14 PM

Doesn't really matter who the coach was if players aren't buying in. 

 

Which leads me to my next question:

 

Why should NBA players but into MDA?


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