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Howard wanted the Lakers to amnesty or "muzzle" Kobe, didn't want to play with him for 2-3 more years


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#81 Majesty

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Posted August 31, 2013 - 05:16 PM

If we got Melo, we'd be a team that losses in the WCF/WCSF  each other, get to the Finals if lucky. We'd need a 3rd good player. If we got LeBron, we'd win the title, defense would not matter. But, what if we don't? What do we do? Get a defensive big like Andrew Bogut? Make a trade? Wait around for 2015? I am not a fan of that, it will waste a chance for Kobe to win a 6th ring. 



Getting Carmelo on the team wouldn't ensure a title but it would at the very least make us a scary team if we kept our experiments this year and they panned out and got contracts here.

A team with

Nash
Kobe
Gasol

Melo
Beasley(if we got him this year)
Young

Johnson
Farmar
Hill
Kaman

Is a nice base and going into 2015 with more space when Nash's contract ends and Rondo and Love are available as well as McGee.


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#82 Ven

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Posted August 31, 2013 - 05:51 PM

Any Melo team is a guaranteed playoff team at the very least.



#83 Jody Smokes

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Posted August 31, 2013 - 07:42 PM

Umm..thats not exactly saying anything.  Making the playoffs means little when you are gonna get rocked by the better teams in the NBA

Any Melo team is a guaranteed playoff team at the very least.


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#84 Jody Smokes

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Posted August 31, 2013 - 07:44 PM

If they sign Melo in 2014 and bring back Kobe and Pau there won't be enough cap space to sign Rondo and Love.  You can't hold on to Kobe/Pau and expect to just sign 2 max level stars and another high level contract guy.  Unless you believe Pau and Kobe are going to sign for vet mini's.

 



Getting Carmelo on the team wouldn't ensure a title but it would at the very least make us a scary team if we kept our experiments this year and they panned out and got contracts here.

A team with

Nash
Kobe
Gasol

Melo
Beasley(if we got him this year)
Young

Johnson
Farmar
Hill
Kaman

Is a nice base and going into 2015 with more space when Nash's contract ends and Rondo and Love are available as well as McGee.


"Blake and Parker are good at canceling each other out till our bench point guard comes in"  - Majesty aka Bird Ish (12/4/13)


#85 Windu

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Posted August 31, 2013 - 07:46 PM

Umm..thats not exactly saying anything.  Making the playoffs means little when you are gonna get rocked by the better teams in the NBA

 

We'll accomplish this a lot with MDA


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#86 LakeShow805

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Posted August 31, 2013 - 09:27 PM



Getting Carmelo on the team wouldn't ensure a title but it would at the very least make us a scary team if we kept our experiments this year and they panned out and got contracts here.

A team with

Nash
Kobe
Gasol

Melo
Beasley(if we got him this year)
Young

Johnson
Farmar
Hill
Kaman

Is a nice base and going into 2015 with more space when Nash's contract ends and Rondo and Love are available as well as McGee.

A 40 year old as our starting pg......doesn't sound that great.



#87 MidnightMarauder

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Posted August 31, 2013 - 09:29 PM

Melo is great as a number 2. I'm cool with the Lakers getting him but we need someone else like a Kevin Love to be a championship team. Melo alone is not a LeBron or Kobe type that can be the best player on a title team.



#88 Jody Smokes

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Posted August 31, 2013 - 10:28 PM

I agree but neither is Kevin Love. Lakers have 2 options.  Find the next elite guy via draft or current elite guy in free agency or build a new culture with a great team and stay competitive over time and hit a home run at some point. 

Melo is great as a number 2. I'm cool with the Lakers getting him but we need someone else like a Kevin Love to be a championship team. Melo alone is not a LeBron or Kobe type that can be the best player on a title team.


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#89 Yaboy

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Posted September 01, 2013 - 09:06 AM

Love isn't getting la a title.... Let's see if he can even get his team to the playoffs this year.

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#90 Jody Smokes

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Posted September 01, 2013 - 02:25 PM

Unless you have a top elite guy say a current Lebron, KD or prime Kobe like player you need to be competitive by star player committee so to speak.  A team with K Love and Rondo with another quality wing would be a great foundation with the right coaching staff.

Love isn't getting la a title.... Let's see if he can even get his team to the playoffs this year.


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#91 Windu

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Posted September 01, 2013 - 02:33 PM

the right coaching staff.

 

And until we get that, people clamoring for Lebron James, Carmelo Anthony, Kevin Love, Chris Paul, Rajon Rondo, or whomever, are simply wasting their time.


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#92 Japago

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Posted September 04, 2013 - 02:19 AM

And until we get that, people clamoring for Lebron James, Carmelo Anthony, Kevin Love, Chris Paul, Rajon Rondo, or whomever, are simply wasting their time.

 

This how I feel too. At the very least, there's already an established bad history between MDA and Melo. So I definitely think he wouldn't even consider coming here if he were still coach.

 

Beyond that, he's a big reason why Dwight left. And when the Knicks were in the same situation with him as coach in 2010, the only player they lured in was Stoudemire. I'm not even sure if there were any other teams who were interested with him because he couldn't get insurance for his knees. I think even the Suns didn't want him back.

 

I get the feeling having MDA may actually be worse than having an unproven coach for attracting FAs. McHale doesn't have a great head coaching history and Spoelstra didn't have one either when the big 3 got together.


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#93 Majesty

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Posted September 04, 2013 - 04:12 AM

If you think Carmelo would stay in New York with Stoudemire and Bargnani another year(after failing again this year which the Knicks will)  and then wouldn't come to the Lakers where Kobe is, within the exact same system he's played his best basketball under  just because D'antoni is coach I think that's a bit of an overshot.


Carmelo can take D'antoni being his coach if it means he doesn't have to carry the Knicks for another year for a coach that has it within his power to play Melo at the 4 and refuses to and would rather throw an injured him into a game where the team is down 10 after a run by the bench.


Woodson was by far a pretty terrible coach this year, and in dire straights looked as bad as or worse than D'antoni has before.

When you look at it, it comes down to systems and it comes down to winning, and it comes down to getting paid.

Melo gets the money and the system in LA that he has in new york, but he doesn't have JR Smith next to him he has Kobe Bryant, and he doesn't have to wait for Amare's contract to expire for them to start being able to make any kind of roster moves.

LA and D'antoni is the lesser of two evils.  Kobe is a major reason for that.

And for those saying "Melo wants to be the man and carry a team"  right... just like he's had to do in New York for the past 3 years which has lead nowhere while the roster around him gets worse and worse and worse.

When the Knicks fail again this year Melo is as good as gone.


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#94 Jody Smokes

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Posted September 04, 2013 - 06:09 AM

You conveniently ignore all the other factors and act like Melo just has this huge mancrush for Kobe and this great desire to team up with him.  In the end NY right now has the better overall roster and team and its really not even a debate.  A lot of why NY will continue to be a 2nd round team is because of Melo.  He just isn't that great.  Not sure why this is so hard for you to understand. 

 

Melo doesn't really even solve any issues for the Lakers.  He just brings a name.  As I've said before, if you plan on playing Melo at the 4 you'd better have someone at the 5 that can hold down the paint and play pick and roll like Chandler.  Pau can't do that.  We'd get destroyed on the defensive end.  I'd rather they sign Lowry and Rudy Gay for the price of one Melo than go after Melo. 

If you think Carmelo would stay in New York with Stoudemire and Bargnani another year(after failing again this year which the Knicks will)  and then wouldn't come to the Lakers where Kobe is, within the exact same system he's played his best basketball under  just because D'antoni is coach I think that's a bit of an overshot.


Carmelo can take D'antoni being his coach if it means he doesn't have to carry the Knicks for another year for a coach that has it within his power to play Melo at the 4 and refuses to and would rather throw an injured him into a game where the team is down 10 after a run by the bench.


Woodson was by far a pretty terrible coach this year, and in dire straights looked as bad as or worse than D'antoni has before.

When you look at it, it comes down to systems and it comes down to winning, and it comes down to getting paid.

Melo gets the money and the system in LA that he has in new york, but he doesn't have JR Smith next to him he has Kobe Bryant, and he doesn't have to wait for Amare's contract to expire for them to start being able to make any kind of roster moves.

LA and D'antoni is the lesser of two evils.  Kobe is a major reason for that.

And for those saying "Melo wants to be the man and carry a team"  right... just like he's had to do in New York for the past 3 years which has lead nowhere while the roster around him gets worse and worse and worse.

When the Knicks fail again this year Melo is as good as gone.


Edited by Jody Smokes, September 04, 2013 - 06:10 AM.

"Blake and Parker are good at canceling each other out till our bench point guard comes in"  - Majesty aka Bird Ish (12/4/13)


#95 Jody Smokes

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Posted September 04, 2013 - 06:17 AM

The problem we keep running into Majesty is that you can't think past him just wanting to play with Kobe.  There are so many variables to consider before he signs.  You can give me Kobe cool, but can you provide me with a better PG than Felton this offseason? Better 6th man than JR? Better young guys like Shump THIS offseason, defensive guys like Tyson Chandler?

 

Everything that would make him want to jump ship has to happen that offseason.  Melo will be 30, he isnt trying to jump ship for 25M less just for a team to try to rebuild around him.  If thats the case he's better off in NY with a younger team and more money and the fact that the org probably isn't going to support the hiring of a coach that he isnt comfortable with.  2015 offseason for the Lakers means little to Melo and probably won't even factor into his decision to come here.  This is what guys wanted Dwight to bank on.  GM's deal with the now AND later.  Players in their prime at looking at what can you do for me now not 2 years from now. 


"Blake and Parker are good at canceling each other out till our bench point guard comes in"  - Majesty aka Bird Ish (12/4/13)


#96 BasketballIQ

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Posted September 04, 2013 - 06:41 AM

The problem we keep running into Majesty is that you can't think past him just wanting to play with Kobe.  There are so many variables to consider before he signs.  You can give me Kobe cool, but can you provide me with a better PG than Felton this offseason? Better 6th man than JR? Better young guys like Shump THIS offseason, defensive guys like Tyson Chandler?

 

Everything that would make him want to jump ship has to happen that offseason.  Melo will be 30, he isnt trying to jump ship for 25M less just for a team to try to rebuild around him.  If thats the case he's better off in NY with a younger team and more money and the fact that the org probably isn't going to support the hiring of a coach that he isnt comfortable with.  2015 offseason for the Lakers means little to Melo and probably won't even factor into his decision to come here.  This is what guys wanted Dwight to bank on.  GM's deal with the now AND later.  Players in their prime at looking at what can you do for me now not 2 years from now. 

It starts with Kobe. Kobe is better than his wing man. Nash just wants to hit open 3s ,some guys prefer to play with a Nash over Ray Felton. I prefer  having him over Ray, because it's less valleys. Far more consistent day to day.



#97 Jody Smokes

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Posted September 04, 2013 - 06:52 AM

If we are talking going into the 14-15 season Nash isn't even a factor or he shouldn't be.  He will also be 41.  Actually Nash this year when healthy wasn't a better overall player than Felton.  Nash shooting is also an overblown factor.  While he is an all time great shooter he doesnt shoot very much.  Nash avg 2.8 3's a game this year.  Thats not going to be a big factor in a season.  Nash being demoted to Steve Kerr doesn't sit well with me either. 


Edited by Jody Smokes, September 04, 2013 - 06:53 AM.

"Blake and Parker are good at canceling each other out till our bench point guard comes in"  - Majesty aka Bird Ish (12/4/13)


#98 Jody Smokes

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Posted September 04, 2013 - 07:08 AM

Outside of Kobe, roster wise there is not plus in LA.  Everything that could be an upgrade to what NY has vs LA in 2014 would have to come via free agency in 2014.  2015 free agency period is not a selling point or plus to Melo. 

 

2014 class upgrades

PG: Lowry

SG: No need if healthy Kobe

SF: Rudy Gay, Granger(if healthy), Ariza

PF: This is probably best for Melo

C: Pau (but Melo at the 4 would be stupid with him at the 5)

 

In the Lowry is the only viable upgrade for LA to get over what NY has.  Chandler/Melo would be much better overall than Pau/Melo and Melo with Granger or Gay is too much overlap. 

 

I'd much rather sign Lowry and Gay than Melo.  Probably would be the same price combined and solves 2 issues.

It starts with Kobe. Kobe is better than his wing man. Nash just wants to hit open 3s ,some guys prefer to play with a Nash over Ray Felton. I prefer  having him over Ray, because it's less valleys. Far more consistent day to day.


"Blake and Parker are good at canceling each other out till our bench point guard comes in"  - Majesty aka Bird Ish (12/4/13)


#99 Japago

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Posted September 04, 2013 - 07:15 AM

I don't get the line of thinking that Woodson is worse than MDA. The Knicks and Melo played better pretty much as soon as Woodson took over as coach.

 

The Knicks were in danger of missing the playoffs in 2011-2012 when they started 18-24. They fired MDA, then went 18-6. They looked a lot better this season than at any point with MDA too.

 

Melo would take Woodson over MDA in a heartbeat.


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#100 Jody Smokes

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Posted September 04, 2013 - 08:00 AM

Another thing to consider is that maybe Melo is really committed to NY?  All of us are fans and most of you guys can't look outside of that lens from a different POV.  You may think NY is a cess pool of losing but why should Melo believe that as their franchise guy?  The franchise rest in his hands, if he can't win with that team he can't win here either.


"Blake and Parker are good at canceling each other out till our bench point guard comes in"  - Majesty aka Bird Ish (12/4/13)





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