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Tanking for 2014 Draft


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#21 fido

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Posted May 20, 2013 - 10:02 PM

Nope, I'm done.

 

Not feeding into a nonsense argument.



#22 TKainZero

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Posted May 20, 2013 - 10:58 PM

Nope, I'm done.
 
Not feeding into a nonsense argument.


It's better to walk away when your wrong...

I don't get why you would deny the warriors were tanking...
Do you work for the golden state warriors PR department?
Because then it would make some sense...

More sense then you not following the NBA at all...
I mean, everyone knew they were openly tanking...

#23 Real Deal

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Posted May 20, 2013 - 11:33 PM

Golden State didn't trade Ellis to tank, they traded him because he was a selfish two-guard that was smothering the ball, and because it got them a center that would actually play defense.
 
Additionally, it opened up a starting role for Klay Thompson, a shooter, who is a FAR better fit with Curry.

Nobody else wanted Ellis, just like nobody showed interest in him before Skiles took a hike in Milwaukee.
 
The Warriors were in the bottom five in the NBA in defense most of the year, first half or second, last season.  With Bogut this year, and without Monta Ellis gambling all the time, they were 14th.
 
--------
 
As far as shutting down Curry goes...you're incorrect.  The Warriors went 1-6 in his first seven games.  He started missing games immediately.  He missed the THIRD game of the year, then eight in a row after just the SIXTH game of the season.
 
Curry was showing signs of an injury-ridden season from the start.
 
Played a little in March, and was hurt two more times...dreadful in a handful of games from February - March.  He rolled his ankle twice, that I remember, last season...and that's when he was shut down, after just 26 games.
 
The Warriors were eventually having to start Jeremy Tyler, Charles Jenkins, Dorell Wright, and Mickell Gladness.

Your whole argument is based on the trade of Monta Ellis...and quite frankly, it was a great, great move to get rid of him because, as you can see in Milwaukee, he's a cancer. Scott Skiles probably wanted to tell everyone this when he actually gave up on him, but he didn't...the same way Mark Jackson and the Warriors FO gave up on him and dealt him to replace the absolute TRASH they had at the center position, named Andris Biedrins, who is about as worthless as Robert Sacre.

#24 TKainZero

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Posted May 21, 2013 - 05:27 PM

Why whole argument is based off the fact that they went 5-21 to end the season... this allowed them to secure a top 7 pick, and not have to forfeit the pick otherwise...

 

The other evidence just adds to the argument...

it all adds up...

 

They had incentive to tank...

they went 5-21 their last 26 games, after starting season 18-21...

they traded ellis for a player that was hurt for the entire season...

you don't trade your 2nd best player, for a player that will not play for you that season if they wanted to win last season

 

It was a great move to get rid of monte ellis, and it was a great move to tank and get Harrison barnes...

but you cant sit here and tell me you didn't think they tanked at all last season. I watched a lot of GS games, and it was very clear to everyone, and anyone that watched them



#25 Real Deal

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Posted May 22, 2013 - 01:34 AM

Like I said, nobody else wanted Monta Ellis, and they were determined to get rid of him by the deadline.  Their biggest need was at center.  How many legitimate centers were available for Monta?  Only Bogut, who was injured.

 

But the Warriors also got rid of Kwame Brown (who was making nearly $7 million a year) and Ekpe Udoh (at $3.3 million and 2 1/2 years left on his contract).

 

But let's keep going...because Jackson basically went to the Warriors in that deal...and then out to the Spurs for TJ Ford, Richard Jefferson, and a future 1st round draft pick.

 

So, for Ellis (cancer), Kwame (worthless) and Udoh (irrelevant), they acquired Bogut (defensive-minded starting center), Jefferson (who is on the roster) and a future 1st.

 

THAT is why Ellis was traded to Milwaukee.

 

Golden State went out to win games.  The front office just knew that the moves made, and the fact that Curry was done at the start of the season (this really can't be argued, he wasn't himself), would make the Warriors worse, talent-wise, but not as far as chemistry goes...and the fact remains that it takes time to develop chemistry, especially when you have a new head coach (and a rookie one at that).

 

So you can't say they were tanking.  That would require them to go out and tell the team to lose games on purpose, or to not play their best players.  Golden State did the right thing by trading Ellis before the summer. and did the right thing acquiring Bogut.  Curry was going to sit, whether they liked it or not.

 

David Lee and Klay Thompson were still playing out there.  Nate Robinson was out there for a while.  Did they tank the last 8-10 games?  Probably, but it was clear as day they couldn't defend anyone.  They were allowing 100+ points every night (it seemed), at one point, five consecutive games of 112+ points.  

 

---------

 

Do you want to know the BEST evidence that they didn't tank?  They won the 65th game of the year.  Both Toronto, and the Warriors, finished 23-43, and had a tie-breaker to determine the 7th pick in the draft.

 

Toronto won the final game of the season, blowing out the Nets, 98-67.  If they lose it, they get the 7th pick...and the Warriors lose their lotto pick to Utah.

 

Now tell me why Golden State wins their 65th game, knowing that if they DON'T, they lock up their lotto pick...and if they DO win, it gives the Raptors a chance to lock it up with a loss in the final game of the season.



#26 Majesty

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Posted May 22, 2013 - 03:01 AM

Monta Ellis aka the new poor man's JR Smith.

 

If he ever accepts being a bench player.


 

I've always liked Steve Blake.

 


#27 TKainZero

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Posted May 22, 2013 - 11:10 AM

Golden State went out to win games.  The front office just knew that the moves made, and the fact that Curry was done at the start of the season (this really can't be argued, he wasn't himself), would make the Warriors worse, talent-wise, but not as far as chemistry goes...and the fact remains that it takes time to develop chemistry, especially when you have a new head coach (and a rookie one at that).

 

So you can't say they were tanking.  That would require them to go out and tell the team to lose games on purpose, or to not play their best players.  Golden State did the right thing by trading Ellis before the summer. and did the right thing acquiring Bogut.  Curry was going to sit, whether they liked it or not.

 

David Lee and Klay Thompson were still playing out there.  Nate Robinson was out there for a while.  Did they tank the last 8-10 games?  Probably, but it was clear as day they couldn't defend anyone.  They were allowing 100+ points every night (it seemed), at one point, five consecutive games of 112+ points.  

 

---------

 

Do you want to know the BEST evidence that they didn't tank?  They won the 65th game of the year.  Both Toronto, and the Warriors, finished 23-43, and had a tie-breaker to determine the 7th pick in the draft.

 

Toronto won the final game of the season, blowing out the Nets, 98-67.  If they lose it, they get the 7th pick...and the Warriors lose their lotto pick to Utah.

 

Now tell me why Golden State wins their 65th game, knowing that if they DON'T, they lock up their lotto pick...and if they DO win, it gives the Raptors a chance to lock it up with a loss in the final game of the season.

 

 

Watching the Golden State Warriors last season, It was clear they were tanking...

GS fans knew it...

Casual fans knew it...

They tanked, got a great player in barnes...

5-21 in their last 26 games... 3 victories against the t-wolves...

 

 

I bet Toronto wishes they would have tanked the last game of the season against the Nets... Its strange, because the nets had the 6th pick, but had traded it to Portland(mid season)... but they just have an incompetent over... so their moral was/is in the toilet (better since move to brokeland)

 

maybe golden states tanking wasn't as procounced as it seemed... but they were still tanking it up...

Especially when Golden State played vs the lakers... mike brown vs marc Jackson... lakers were having trouble vs golden state... and it was embarresing... because everyone could tell the Warriors weren't trying to win, but the lakers could still barely beat them...

 

and, by the end of the season, GS was starting a bunch of d-leagers on 10 day contracts and rookies...

GS made a descesion to tank, and it paid off...

 

 

 

now, back to the topic...

I think many teams will tank for the 2014 draft...

Like how there was an NFL season to Suck for Luck...

There needs to be a slogan for wiggins/parker...



#28 Real Deal

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Posted May 22, 2013 - 11:24 AM

Haha...so, it's just strange. No real explanation why Golden State would win that second-to-last game and risk losing that lotto pick, just strange?

David Lee started the first eight games of April, actually, and then he hurt himself against the Mavericks, after scoring 30 points and leading a rally to outscore Dallas in the second half of that game.

http://espn.go.com/n...y-season-injury

So no Curry or Lee, and Ellis traded...what did you expect? They STILL were starting Klay Thompson and Richard Jefferson to end the season, and Brandon Rush was playing incredible basketball (borderline all-star play) in the month of April.

You stated they were tanking the minute Curry was hurt and pulled from the lineup. You have no proof of that.

The Lakers were struggling to beat the Warriors? We didn't have Kobe Bryant, and we still won by double-digits. It was a 17-point game at the end of the third (last game against them that season, mid-April).

You know what's funny, though? Look at this box score, from April 1st (when Golden State was supposedly tanking):

http://www.basketbal...1204010LAL.html

Doesn't look like they were trying to lose that game against us, and that was with Kobe. They had Lee, Klay, Jenkins, Wright and Tyler starting...and they shot 49%, 52% from three, scored 112 points, had just 5 turnovers with 31 assists on 44 made shots. Tanking?



#29 TKainZero

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Posted May 22, 2013 - 11:45 AM

Haha...so, it's just strange. No real explanation why Golden State would win that second-to-last game and risk losing that lotto pick, just strange?

 

Hard to sell to a bunch of 10 day contract players, and rookies, the merits of a 5 year plan...

 

I don't know what to say.. you make great points... but they tanked last season...

You should totally work for the GS PR office...

 

Look at this article from buissness insider...

 

http://www.businessi...-tanking-2013-5

 

 

Now a Golden State Warriors fan page, devoted to last seasons tanking chances... and tracking their loses...

http://www.goldensta...and-predictions

 

 

 

http://www.thebiglea...ing-swimmingly/

 

 

Also, im totally LOLing at GS fans who said the team could have tanked better if they had kept ellis...

 

 

Of course, nothing would be complete without an article with an opposing view...

 

http://blog.sfgate.c...k-warriors-ask/

 

 

 

But, we end it with a BILL SIMMONS GRANTLAND piece!!!

 

http://www.grantland...hardest-stretch

 

I have no problem with a team tanking to get a top-three pick. Nor does it bother me when a team tanks with a modicum of decency and respect to competitive basketball. NBA basketball is a long game and sometimes it's necessary to sacrifice a season for the future. But there's no way to defend how the Warriors are tanking this year. By sitting Stephen Curry, by trading away Monta Ellis for an injured Andrew Bogut, by sitting David Lee, by openly pining for the return of their first-round pick, Golden State set a new standard for no-shame tanking. Again, this might be forgivable if the Warriors were trying to get themselves in position to draft Anthony Davis or Michael Kidd-Gilchrist, but to so openly piss on the standards of competition for the no. 7 pick is inexcusable.

 

Harrison barnes was totally worth everything they did to get him...

Few will remember their Tank Job when Barnes makes an all star game...






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