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Charles Barkley: "You can't teach big."


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#1 Cato

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Posted March 23, 2013 - 12:48 PM

So everyone's frustrated and there's being a lot of blame thrust (fairly or unfairly) at Pau, MDA, MWP, etc.

 

Doesn't anyone just wish we just pounded the [expletive] out of teams inside relentlessly? We have two 7 footer's and whatever else anyone has to say about Pau, stick his ass on the low block and he's going to produce. 

 

We need to know who we are. Nash is a (great) spot up shooter at this point in his career. Kobe hero ball obviously hasn't worked the past few seasons. We should just put our big guys down low and never let them go 10 ft from the basket unless its a high low. I remember when Pau and Bynum would just play volleyball down low. No reason Dwight and Pau can't dominate if they get a combined 30 shots a game.

 

It's pretty to think so at least. I'm going to go hit my volcano and listen to Bob Marley now...



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Posted March 23, 2013 - 01:21 PM

So everyone's frustrated and there's being a lot of blame thrust (fairly or unfairly) at Pau, MDA, MWP, etc.

 

Doesn't anyone just wish we just pounded the [expletive] out of teams inside relentlessly? We have two 7 footer's and whatever else anyone has to say about Pau, stick his ass on the low block and he's going to produce. 

Can somebody pull up those seriously disturbing stats regarding Pau in the post this season please? I think MDI originally posted them, maybe LAKER & a few others...?


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#3 Mr Terrific

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Posted March 23, 2013 - 01:26 PM

Can somebody pull up those seriously disturbing stats regarding Pau in the post this season please? I think MDI originally posted them, maybe LAKER & a few others...?

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#4 Cato

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Posted March 23, 2013 - 01:28 PM

Can somebody pull up those seriously disturbing stats regarding Pau in the post this season please? I think MDI originally posted them, maybe LAKER & a few others...?

 

OK, fair. Let me re-phrase. 

 

Put Pau on the low block never going 10 ft from the rim, and he's going to produce significantly more than he has been.



#5 Majesty

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Posted March 23, 2013 - 01:29 PM

You mean the stats where Gasol was shooting worse in the post at a lower efficiency than his mid range shot?

I posted them somewhere but don't feel like looking. I posted a screen shot too.

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#6 L.A.K.E.R

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Posted March 23, 2013 - 01:33 PM

Can somebody pull up those seriously disturbing stats regarding Pau in the post this season please? I think MDI originally posted them, maybe LAKER & a few others...?

 

This is as all I've got on hand right now, though I do vaguely recall what you're referring to. I think it was some article that used Synergy stats.

 

What I've got is: http://www.hoopdata....?name=Pau Gasol

 

At Rim : 69%

3-9 Feet: 34%

10-15 Feet: 30%

16-23 Feet: 38%

Threes: 46%

 

Aside from his finishing at the rim (which is the same) and threes (which has improved), Pau as a whole has become drastically ineffective on offense. It's pretty obvious if you watch and games and look through his game logs. He's missed many shots this season that he used to finish with no issues from '08-10. It's mostly due to the fact that he's just not aggressive on the low block. I've seen him shoot when he has the open lane AND speed advantage on his man 15+ feet out, shoot fadeaways instead of posting with a hook shot on the low block, and he simply doesn't fight for position. From 3-9 feet out, only around 56% of those are assisted (meaning Pau simply catches and finishes), while the rest are off post-ups. He's been horribly ineffective, 34% is DeMarcus Cousins territory.

 

It doesn't matter if Dwight is on the floor or not, I've seen him consistently disappear for stretches of games this entire season. There are only a handful of games where he really shone, and I can probably count them all on one hand. It's like having Lamar Odom all over again. And not the 6MOTY version.



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Posted March 23, 2013 - 01:35 PM

All I know is that off the bench HE WAS producing more overall and it was so obvious just right before he had to go out because of his injury. Bottomline is he's an unselfish player to begin with, you put him in there with Dwight, Kobe, & Nash & he's gonna' defer even more. I just don't know how anyone forgets what a different player he was coming off the bench than when he was starting. Maybe some here missed those games? Yeah he [expletive]ed & moaned about it at first, but the we were actually winning games and after that was happening, he didn't say too much rightfully so.

 

There really should be no argument towards defending Gasol as much as you & a very select few do when even players themselves such as Nash see this so clearly and make comments clearly indicating so.

 

Just at least give me less of Dwight & Pau on the court at the same time & I'll be happier, just as we were seeing a lot of before he went down.


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#8 Cato

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Posted March 23, 2013 - 01:38 PM

Small sample size this season. I just looked at his numbers from last season and they're pretty good on the low block. 

 

Or maybe I've been smoking too much kush and Pau's completely and irrevocably broken, in which case it's a moot point and we have no chance winning a playoff series this year.



#9 Majesty

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Posted March 23, 2013 - 01:46 PM

34% basically from the post is all that need be said. His highest percentage is basically layups and dunks...as it should be.

But 7 footer shooting 34% from the post basically...that's all that needs to be said.

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Posted March 23, 2013 - 01:48 PM

Small sample size this season. I just looked at his numbers from last season and they're pretty good on the low block. 

But why are you even looking at last season in the first place? Last season is and has been long gone. We live in a what have you done for me lately mentality, especially in sports. Sorry, but that's just the way it is, especially an organization such as ours when we've set such a standard for excellence and winning at the highest level across decades.

 

I understand that there is still some denial on your part clearly. I wish I and the majority were wrong as well. I really want what's best for the Lakers as should any fan, but there's a difference between wanting and accepting the reality that that prime, hungry, & consistent Pau Gasol is just not coming back so we must comply & move on with the proper adjustments to still find ways to get the most out of him while at the same hurting us the least with all his grand deficiencies, especially this season.


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#11 24allday

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Posted March 23, 2013 - 02:04 PM

Small sample size this season. I just looked at his numbers from last season and they're pretty good on the low block. 

 

Or maybe I've been smoking too much kush and Pau's completely and irrevocably broken, in which case it's a moot point and we have no chance winning a playoff series this year.

I'd go with the latter my man



#12 Ham

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Posted March 23, 2013 - 02:06 PM

god damn he just came off an injury and just got his first game back. give the man a break


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Posted March 23, 2013 - 02:11 PM

^ We can't afford giving breaks, being soft, & cuddling our players, especially not right now, not with the situation we've put ourselves in. It's a desperate one and every single game is equally crucial. No time for that BS. Man up or sit down.


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#14 Ham

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Posted March 23, 2013 - 02:18 PM

^ We can't afford giving breaks, being soft, & cuddling our players, especially not right now, not with the situation we've put ourselves in. It's a desperate one and every single game is equally crucial. No time for that BS. Man up or sit down.

lol you act like pau was the sole reason we loss yesterday. i don't see any posts about metta being an idiot. or kobe playing hero ball that ultimately failed and ruining ball movement in the fourth...

 

.... :laughing:

 

also you can't play big 15 ft from the rim.


Edited by Ham, March 23, 2013 - 02:18 PM.

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Posted March 23, 2013 - 02:22 PM

you can't play big 15 ft from the rim.

Tell me these stats aren't disturbing at all:

This is as all I've got on hand right now, though I do vaguely recall what you're referring to. I think it was some article that used Synergy stats.

 

What I've got is: http://www.hoopdata....?name=Pau Gasol


3-9 Feet: 34%

10-15 Feet: 30%

16-23 Feet: 38%

Threes: 46%


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#16 Ham

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Posted March 23, 2013 - 02:25 PM

Tell me these stats aren't disturbing at all:

How many times is he in the post? 0. We all know what he can do in there. He was doing it before he got injured.


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Posted March 23, 2013 - 02:26 PM

^ I noticed him doing it more as well as a lot more effectively coming OFF the bench prior to going out with injury, but very little when he was starting alongside Dwight.


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#18 Ham

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Posted March 23, 2013 - 02:33 PM

^ I noticed him doing it more as well as a lot more effectively coming OFF the bench prior to going out with injury, but very little when he was starting alongside Dwight.

lol imo he is better than dwight in the post. Dwight needs so much space its ridiculous. Without all that space he is basically close to useless on the offensive end. Thats why he needs a stretch four to begin with. Bynum never needed that much space when we ran with pau and bynum. we can't have them on the floor at the same time. MDA should enforce this like he use to. But we won't win when people like Metta making bonehead plays thinking he's lebron. Yesterday, should've been a lock by the 3rd quarter.

smh. go back to benching him. he's better there, makes him work harder. Kobe needs to stop too much playing hero ball too.

 

next game guys.


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Posted March 23, 2013 - 02:38 PM

we can't have them on the floor at the same time. MDA should enforce this like he use to.

At least we both definitely see eye to eye on this. That's what I'm asking for most. Don't think it's too much to ask. Why go away from what was working for us most? Frustrating.


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#20 Majesty

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Posted March 23, 2013 - 02:39 PM

How many times is he in the post? 0. We all know what he can do in there. He was doing it before he got injured.



3-9 feet IS in the post.


You're gonna ignore 34% from the post in the entire season because of 2 games? 2 games seriously? Are you THAT desperate?

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