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The Lakers would be better without Kobe


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#61 MyJohnsonIsMagic

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Posted January 03, 2013 - 11:22 AM

This guy must live on a ranch or somewhere secluded or by a bunch of Kobe haters.

If he lived in LA someone would of smacked his head on straight.

#62 -Wade-

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Posted January 03, 2013 - 11:31 AM



Don't you ever forget it jasonC
Spoiler

Edited by -Wade-, January 03, 2013 - 11:35 AM.

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"I'm always a firm believer in us being able to make our own decisions." --Kobe Bryant


#63 jasonC

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Posted January 03, 2013 - 11:31 AM

Most people seem to translate what I said to be "Kobe can't play anymore." I never even suggested that. It's just he can't break out of alpha-dog mode and until he can this team will not reach their potential.

Nash has taken less talented Suns teams to the playoffs, no reason this season can't result in a Finals appearance or a championship with the super talented roster they have.

I want the Lakers to win just like most people here.

#64 -Wade-

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Posted January 03, 2013 - 11:32 AM

Most people seem to translate what I said to be "Kobe can't play anymore." I never even suggested that. It's just he can't break out of alpha-dog mode and until he can this team will not reach their potential.


It's more so your thread title. It's fallacious.

wKNsigp.png

"I'm always a firm believer in us being able to make our own decisions." --Kobe Bryant


#65 MyJohnsonIsMagic

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Posted January 03, 2013 - 11:42 AM

Most people seem to translate what I said to be "Kobe can't play anymore." I never even suggested that. It's just he can't break out of alpha-dog mode and until he can this team will not reach their potential.

Nash has taken less talented Suns teams to the playoffs, no reason this season can't result in a Finals appearance or a championship with the super talented roster they have.

I want the Lakers to win just like most people here.


Yeah but you are sharing your opinion, you aren't sharing facts.

If you said anything that made any sort of sense we'd agree, but you are just being silly and biased.

RD took the time to reply to your stupid statements, and you reply like 3 seconds later with one of
the dumbest comments ever posted in the history of these forums.

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#66 Real Deal

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Posted January 03, 2013 - 12:24 PM

I am not trying to bad mouth Kobe. He is proving game after game that he can still score with the best of them, however facts show when he takes over so many shots per game the Lakers have an abysmal record. When he reigns it in a bit and shares the wealth, their record is quite a bit better.

That's typically what happens when the team struggles. Who else is going to take those shots?

When we are down big in a game, the only chance we have at that point is Kobe going off. It has gotten us close a lot of times, but then, it's wasted simply because our guys never carry that energy over from Kobe.

In a blowout win, Kobe plays less minutes...which usually means less shots.

That's kind of how things work with any starter, and especially superstars.

Im not trying to turn the Lakers into the Suns but somebody is because they went out and got Nash, then hired D'antoni. Kobe is holding the team back by trying to prove he is still as good as Lebron, Durant, etc.

Well, let me know who is trying to turn us into the Phoenix Suns, so I can slap them in the face. Phoenix never found their way to the NBA Finals for a reason. They didn't play defense, and they relied heavily on Nash creating for everyone on that team...and that meant they lived and died by the three, given the system.

So, it looks like you want us to be the Suns...and you're assuming Nash is still the guy from 2004, and not the one from the last two seasons, who has struggled greatly staying in the game, struggled getting to the rim and scoring, and an even worse defender than he was when he won his two MVP awards.

Okay then.

--------------------------

Kobe doesn't have to be better than LeBron or Durant to lead this team to a championship as the primary scorer, and the one guy this team is built around. Didn't Dirk do that in 2011? I believe it was Dirk who beat out a guy (LeBron) that basically played EXACTLY how you want Kobe to play, correct?

Did you have a problem with Kobe doing all of this in 2009 and 2010, when he was LESS efficient? Maybe we could have played like the Suns, instead...you know, the 46-win Suns, led by Nash, that missed the playoffs and watched Kobe lead the Lakers to a championship in 2009 with lesser numbers than he's putting up today.

#67 leor_77

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Posted January 03, 2013 - 12:47 PM

This issue is not black and white - There are games where Kobe is just great, and the loss is purely on other players/factors, but sometimes the losses ARE on him, and sometimes there's a mixture.

The most important thing is that we need good quality, efficient shots, and that we need to keep the bigs involved. Sure, our BIGS NEED TO PLAY BETTER, but is there anyone here who doesn't like to see Nash probe, and then either hit the mid-range shot, or pass it off to Dwight or Pau 2-feet from the basket for an easy, efficient shot? Are there also people who disagree with the fact that if you get everyone involved, they will play better on both sides of the court? It's not whether you like it or think it should be that way, it is just simply the way things work.

Sometimes Kobe iso ball is good, but I've seen the most success when I see him in transition, coming off of back-screens, or just when Nash flings him the ball in a good spot with good spacing between he and his defender, and also obviously when he looks to facilitate for the bigs. I've also seen the most success late in games when Nash has the ball and makes the decisions, whether to get the ball to Kobe, someone else or to shoot it himself. I also really hoped I would see better defense from Kobe. Just my two cents...

#68 Jay Cee

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Posted January 03, 2013 - 12:49 PM

Kobe's PER is the highest it has been in his career I think. And for the month of December he posted career highs across the board (ppg, rebounds, assists) while shooting a very high percentage. He is inconsistent on defense, occasionally forces shots, but no player is perfect. I'll take his shortcomings, he more than makes up for them. The Lakers without Kobe would not be better.

#69 jasonC

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Posted January 03, 2013 - 01:43 PM

I realize where I am, in Laker Land. I know Kobe Bryant is King in Laker Land. I know a lot of you guys have been with him for years and believe in him. I know Kobe has 5 rings(3 with Shaq, 2 with Pau.)

Still I'm fairly confident that if Kobe had to miss 15-20 games with some sort of an injury, that Nash could get this team to fire on all cylinders.

#70 MyJohnsonIsMagic

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Posted January 03, 2013 - 01:48 PM

Still I'm fairly confident that if Kobe had to miss 15-20 games with some sort of an injury, that Nash could get this team to fire on all cylinders.


Oh yes, how could we forget about all the championships Nash and D'antoni won.

#71 jasonC

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Posted January 03, 2013 - 01:53 PM

Kobe didn't win any without Shaq or Pau.

I remember a couple times where the Suns put the Lakers out in early playoff rounds and during that time Kobe Bryant was begging to get out of L.A.

No matter how good you are, no matter how many points you score, you cannot win a championship by yourself. I'm sure Mr. Bryant knows this by now. Kobe had 81 points in a game vs Toronto once, I don't believe the Lakers had a great season that year.

I know the Lakers can win and just like all of you, I want them to.

#72 pkflyers

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Posted January 03, 2013 - 02:17 PM

so you want us to be a full blown nash led team?

the same nash that can only play 30MPG?

ok


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#73 West Coast

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Posted January 03, 2013 - 03:20 PM

Kobe didn't win any without Shaq or Pau.

I remember a couple times where the Suns put the Lakers out in early playoff rounds and during that time Kobe Bryant was begging to get out of L.A.

No matter how good you are, no matter how many points you score, you cannot win a championship by yourself. I'm sure Mr. Bryant knows this by now. Kobe had 81 points in a game vs Toronto once, I don't believe the Lakers had a great season that year.

I know the Lakers can win and just like all of you, I want them to.


You're acting like Kobe doesn't know how to win. The man has five titles because he played team ball.

Your argument is very baseless. Teams with multiple great players win titles. It's very rare when a team sneaks in to win a title. Kobe didn't win without Shaq and Pau.... big deal. Pau didn't win a playoff game before he teamed, Jordan didn't win without Pippen, etc.

Your argument would actually be relevant if Kobe was title-less. He knows how to win. He's not the reason for the Lakers struggles. Has he shot them out of games a few times this year? Sure, but to act like he is the main reason to why this team is average at this point in the season is ridiculous.

#74 MyJohnsonIsMagic

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Posted January 03, 2013 - 04:41 PM

Kobe didn't win any without Shaq or Pau.


Shaq won the Lakers 1 title (the first of the three), the other two were Shaq + Kobe.

Pau Gasol never won a title as the #1 option for the Grizzlies, and he was not the Lakers #1 option
when they won back to back championships so your points are moot.

I remember a couple times where the Suns put the Lakers out in early playoff rounds and during that time Kobe Bryant was begging to get out of L.A.


You have a selective memory don't you son?

Kobe was the only star on that team, aside from Lamar Odom the rest of the guys on that squad were scrubs.

That was not a good team at all, the reason they made the playoffs at all in those years were because of Kobe's scoring.

No matter how good you are, no matter how many points you score, you cannot win a championship by yourself. I'm sure Mr. Bryant knows this by now. Kobe had 81 points in a game vs Toronto once, I don't believe the Lakers had a great season that year.


You obviously know nothing about the Lakers, you are a Nash fan, despite the fact that we are Laker fans most of us
watch basketball period and it doesn't matter if the Lakers are playing or not we are scouting other teams.

So we know what we are talking about, and its obvious to us that you don't know what you are talking about.

I know the Lakers can win and just like all of you, I want them to.


We know the Lakers can win too, but like other D'antoni coached teams the problem is defense not offense you tool.

#75 ColStac

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Posted January 03, 2013 - 05:10 PM

First, I find it funny that a former Suns fan has any advice to a Lakers fan base on how to win. All due respect.

Second, I'll say this again.

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The game changes, the players turnover, but the Mamba remains a constant!

#76 MyJohnsonIsMagic

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Posted January 03, 2013 - 05:15 PM

Amar’e Stoudemire claims nobody has ever taught him how to play defense

"Just having a defensive coach for the first time in my career is going to help,"

http://sports.yahoo....16043--nba.html

Wasn't Amar'e Stoudemire on the Phoenix Suns squad? [rhetorical question]

I wonder why he claims nobody ever taught him defense (It couldn't of been because of D'antoni) [sarcasm]

D'antoni current head coach of the Lakers...I wonder why the Lakers defense sucks, couldn't possibly be because of Mike D'antoni oh no no.

http://www.opposingv...defensive-focus

Even Dwight Howard called Mike D'antoni out on his lack of defensive practice.

You aren't fooling anybody here jasonC, I don't know what kind of forums you came from before
but the majority of the people here are very knowledgeable of the game of basketball and
the history of the game.

You may be able to get the forum full of tards were you came from to agree with your baseless points,
but not us (so you can keep playing that broken record nobody is listening).

Edited by MyJohnsonIsMagic, January 03, 2013 - 05:28 PM.


#77 L.A.K.E.R

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Posted January 03, 2013 - 05:20 PM

nashfandude

#78 MyJohnsonIsMagic

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Posted January 03, 2013 - 05:23 PM

nashfandude


Read my mind bro, seriously.

#79 jasonC

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Posted January 03, 2013 - 05:29 PM

Was not my intention to stir up so many ill feelings.


Go Lakers.

God Bless.

#80 MyJohnsonIsMagic

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Posted January 03, 2013 - 06:29 PM

Was not my intention to stir up so many ill feelings.


You are new here, and one of your first if not your first threads is titled "The Lakers would be better without Kobe".

Then you later go and say: Most people seem to translate what I said to be "Kobe can't play anymore." I never even suggested that.

After you made that statement you could of changed the title of the thread (because its misleading) but you didn't,
so to most of us it seemed you were contradicting yourself (and trolling).

Several of our senior members countered your points (including myself) and you kept responding
in basically the same manner giving the same answer over and over again.

I don't know were you previously debated basketball, but the broken record doesn't work here.

We don't know you yet dude but first impressions are everything, and I'm sorry
but you've left a piss poor impression on a majority of us (hence why you got
the responses you did).

There is also this options on the forums called search, you could of used it to see if there wasn't
already a thread similar to this one so you could of gauged our reactions (but you didn't).

I've hated on you enough though for your ignorant statements, I hope you stick around long
enough to learn more about this team and basketball because we have some very
knowledgeable active members and staff when it comes to the game.

Edited by MyJohnsonIsMagic, January 03, 2013 - 06:32 PM.





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