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Nash and D'Antoni's game management


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#1 SportyIntellectual

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Posted December 26, 2012 - 04:25 PM

There are hundreds of possessions per team during an NBA season. But with the team leading late in the 4th quarter yesterday, they rushed shots on 3 separate occasions that really stood out.

Of those 3, the 1 that made NO sense was Nash missing that little jumper with about 1:10 left in the game. There were still 11 seconds on the shot clock. I will concede that it was a fairly high-percentage shot, but by the same token, with just a 5-point lead, Nash has to be thinking about milking the clock.

On subsequent possessions with under a minuute to play, we ended up with free throws being taken by Gasol and by Meeks. Shouldn't the ball be glued to either Nash's or Kobe's hands in that situation?

I know it comes down to execution, when we talk about getting it done in winning time, I don't believe that D'Antoni knows how to manage the game and his personnel.

#2 L.A.K.E.R

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Posted December 26, 2012 - 04:35 PM

Uh...what?

We just won two games against quality opponents specifically because of our game management at the end. We got quality looks on almost every possession down the stretch against both the Warriors and the Knicks. I really don't understand this thread. If anything, D'Antoni's offensive sets and lineups were the main reason for us being able to close out both games. We won both games in "winning time" due to our execution getting it done. Strange thread.

#3 Majesty

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Posted December 26, 2012 - 04:38 PM

I wonder if your name sort of counts as bypassing the swear filter.

anyway


I don't see HOW you can hate on Nash taking a wide open layup considering he'd been nailing that shot his entire career.

it makes no sense really that he would NOT take the best shot possible just because there's seconds left on the shot clock. Why would he waste time till there's a second left on the shot clock for a low percentage shot at the end of a shot clock.

If you weigh both options, one you an waste time on the shotclock to where you HAVE to put up a shot at the end no matter where you are on the court or what the defense has adjusted to and will probably be a difficult shot.

or you can take advantage of an early opening and score potentially pushing the lead to 7 and putting more pressure on the offense next time down.

I'm really not getting your logic that is saying "why extend the lead if there's 11 seconds on the shot clock, it would be a better strategy to waste more time which potentially means a worse shot would happen because the defense has adjusted."

If we're up by 5 and we got an easy layup opportunity WE TAKE IT! No matter what seconds are left on the shot clock. ESPECIALLY if it's Nash taking it.

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#4 bobekryant

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Posted December 26, 2012 - 05:01 PM

If we're up by 5 and we got an easy layup opportunity WE TAKE IT! No matter what seconds are left on the shot clock. ESPECIALLY if it's Nash taking it.

This. How many times have we seen Kobe get the ball with 6-7 seconds left on the shot clock and he has to put up a highly contested shot? OP is basically saying let's do that instead of taking a high percentage shot when the opportunity arises.

#5 Disaster in Paradise

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Posted December 26, 2012 - 05:15 PM

I don't see anything wrong with getting a good, uncontested shot late in games.

I can't...

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#6 MrKnowItAll

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Posted December 26, 2012 - 05:23 PM

So you're telling me you're gonna make a thread questioning a coach and his point guard for taking a good shot with eleven seconds left in the shot clock, in a game they won? Wow.

#7 bigfetz

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Posted December 26, 2012 - 05:32 PM


There are hundreds of possessions per team during an NBA season. But with the team leading late in the 4th quarter yesterday, they rushed shots on 3 separate occasions that really stood out.

Of those 3, the 1 that made NO sense was Nash missing that little jumper with about 1:10 left in the game. There were still 11 seconds on the shot clock. I will concede that it was a fairly high-percentage shot, but by the same token, with just a 5-point lead, Nash has to be thinking about milking the clock.

On subsequent possessions with under a minuute to play, we ended up with free throws being taken by Gasol and by Meeks. Shouldn't the ball be glued to either Nash's or Kobe's hands in that situation?

I know it comes down to execution, when we talk about getting it done in winning time, I don't believe that D'Antoni knows how to manage the game and his personnel.

lol he managed it perfect thats why we did this thing called winning the game. I swear people will find anything to [expletive] about. Also they act like the coach is controlling the players with an xbox controller or something.

#8 West Coast

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Posted December 26, 2012 - 05:33 PM

This thread is confusing.

#9 bigfetz

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Posted December 26, 2012 - 05:35 PM

This thread is confusing.

OP is saying that we shouldn't take a wide open shot at the end of the game and apparently its all MD's fault...but we won. :smh:

#10 West Coast

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Posted December 26, 2012 - 05:40 PM

OP is saying that we shouldn't take a wide open shot at the end of the game and apparently its all MD's fault...but we won. :smh:


I blame Mike Brown

#11 bigfetz

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Posted December 26, 2012 - 05:44 PM

I blame Mike Brown

I blame Paul Westhead

#12 SportyIntellectual

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Posted December 26, 2012 - 08:41 PM

I'm saying that this is a bad trend. :)

#13 bigfetz

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Posted December 26, 2012 - 08:43 PM

I'm saying that this is a bad trend. :)

Its a bad trend to have one of the best shooters to ever play shoot a wide open shot??

#14 SportyIntellectual

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Posted December 26, 2012 - 09:39 PM

Its a bad trend to have one of the best shooters to ever play shoot a wide open shot??


Correct. In that situation, I think the offensive set shouldn't even start until the 10-second (remaining) mark.

The goal should be to limit the number of possessions in the game, not to create as many as possible.

One of the recurring complaints I'm having with this new 'system' is the amount of mileage it's putting Kobe.

And yes, the impact on his long-term health - and effectiveness - is a concern of mine, even in games they win.

#15 West Coast

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Posted December 26, 2012 - 11:53 PM

You can look at it one of two ways:

1. Run your normal set and if you get the open shot, take it, especially if its a high percentage shot that Nash took.

2. Start the set at 10 seconds and run the risk of being forced to take a tough difficult shot, which will most likely be a three or long two.



Bottom line, I take my chances with the high percentage shot by one of the smartest and skilled point guards in the history of the league. This wasn't a three pointer or long deuce, it was a wide open shot in the paint. The only thing you could possible ask for in that is an open layup or dunk by one our big men if that was an option.

There was 1:10 left in the game at that point, if Nash wasted more time, it still gives the Knicks the ball with about 50 seconds in the game.

Regardless, a team that leads by 8 or less is still going to need to shoot free throws. It's not like that was avoidable.

#16 lakersince75

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Posted December 27, 2012 - 05:13 AM

I blame Paul Westhead

Me too!!! And Rudy T!! :laughing:

#17 SportyIntellectual

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Posted December 27, 2012 - 01:41 PM

You can look at it one of two ways:

1. Run your normal set and if you get the open shot, take it, especially if its a high percentage shot that Nash took.

2. Start the set at 10 seconds and run the risk of being forced to take a tough difficult shot, which will most likely be a three or long two.


Bottom line, I take my chances with the high percentage shot by one of the smartest and skilled point guards in the history of the league. This wasn't a three pointer or long deuce, it was a wide open shot in the paint. The only thing you could possible ask for in that is an open layup or dunk by one our big men if that was an option.

There was 1:10 left in the game at that point, if Nash wasted more time, it still gives the Knicks the ball with about 50 seconds in the game.

Regardless, a team that leads by 8 or less is still going to need to shoot free throws. It's not like that was avoidable.


I don't disagree with any of that.

But the reason I targeted Nash for the criticism is that on the other 2 possessions in that stretch, shots were rushed by other players. I don't expect every player to make the right basketball decision 100% of the time - and even if they do, there's no 100% guarantee of success - but it's something I see all too often.

Regarding the free throws, I can't understand why the ball was in anyone's hands other than Nash's or Kobe's. I have to retract part of my prior statement, as Meeks *should* be added to that list. I was wrong in speaking against him as a free throw shooter. My bad on that.




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