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Lakers Weighing Options At PG


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#161 Lord Flashheart

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Posted December 12, 2012 - 02:02 PM

I have a bad feeling we'll sign someone else and not Delonte.
Impossible is nothing.

#162 Japago

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Posted December 12, 2012 - 02:02 PM

And I'll say this once.

Take away 5 of our turnovers per game and our opponents rarely if ever score above the 80-90 points range,

We lose on an average of 5 points a game because we're a top ranked defensive and offensive team but the PROBLEM is that the turnovers cost us. Our halfcourt defense isn't what's costing us games.

This is the point I'm trying to make with you.

You talk about the importance of wing defenders and defense in the halfcourt but the fact of the matter is we were one of FOUR teams in the NBA that were top 10 offense and defense and we had a sub 500 record because of our turnovers.

So all the issues you complain about mean diddily squat if fixed if our turnover problem still remains.

That's why it's more important than the things you complain about currently and is what will net us the most victories this season over the things you want fixed. That is my point.


Lakers are tied for 14th in defensive efficiency.

It's more than just turnovers. The Lakers can't guard in the half court either.

Metta and PGs allows opposing players at their positions past them at will, and the Lakers' help D isn't great enough to compensate for that.

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#163 Majesty

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Posted December 12, 2012 - 02:06 PM

Lakers are tied for 14th in defensive efficiency.

It's more than just turnovers. The Lakers can't guard in the half court either.

Metta and PGs allows opposing players at their positions past them at will, and the Lakers' help D isn't great enough to compensate for that.


The reason we dropped in defensive efficiency is because of the points we allowed off turnovers and the fast break points scored off of, not because of our halfcourt set.

So once again that rounds back to my first point again. :)

Edited by Majesty, December 12, 2012 - 02:06 PM.

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#164 Japago

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Posted December 12, 2012 - 02:12 PM

The reason we dropped in defensive efficiency is because of the points we allowed off turnovers and the fast break points scored off of, not because of our halfcourt set.

So once again that rounds back to my first point again. :)


I don't have the stats with me right now, but I just see our players getting beat athletically even in the half court. The Lakers have too many old guys to keep up in a league that's getting smaller and faster.

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#165 TheOriginalCZM

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Posted December 12, 2012 - 02:15 PM

If we got the delonte west from Boston, i would be more open to this, but i dunno.....i feel that were going to need more than just delonte....but i agree. I have a feeling the Lakers will look somewhere else...we are talking about the "Lakers" here.

#166 Bjork

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Posted December 12, 2012 - 02:16 PM

If we got the delonte west from Boston, i would be more open to this, but i dunno.....i feel that were going to need more than just delonte....but i agree. I have a feeling the Lakers will look somewhere else...we are talking about the "Lakers" here.

What do you mean if we can get him from boston? He has no team.

#167 Majesty

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Posted December 12, 2012 - 02:20 PM

If we got the delonte west from Boston, i would be more open to this, but i dunno.....i feel that were going to need more than just delonte....but i agree. I have a feeling the Lakers will look somewhere else...we are talking about the "Lakers" here.


yes tell me about how much the front office that got us Steve Nash and Dwight Howard sucks and how you'd do a better job as it's the "Lakers" after all, please :)

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#168 TheOriginalCZM

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Posted December 12, 2012 - 02:20 PM

What do you mean if we can get him from boston? He has no team.

when i say the delonte from boston, i mean when he was in his prime. look up his videos of when he played in boston. Now that's the kind of PG we need.

yes tell me about how much the front office that got us Steve Nash and Dwight Howard sucks and how you'd do a better job as it's the "Lakers" after all, please :)

well obviously they didn't address the main concerns of this team "bench". yes the bench is a lot better from last year, but was it enough? Like i always say, that's what you get when you try and center a team with scrubs/players that are past their prime or just about over the hill around one/two guys(Laker front office logic). This is the -ish that you get. If you want an example of a good front office job...look at the clippers for an example, and they did it WITHOUT a GM.

Edited by Mr.Sources, December 12, 2012 - 02:28 PM.


#169 Japago

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Posted December 12, 2012 - 02:21 PM

I don't have the stats with me right now, but I just see our players getting beat athletically even in the half court. The Lakers have too many old guys to keep up in a league that's getting smaller and faster.


Ok, I got one.

The Lakers are the 2nd to worst team in terms of committing turnovers. You know who else is in the bottom 1/3 in the league? San Antonio, OKC, and Golden State. All 3 have much better records right now.

San Antonio only averages 1.1 less, Golden State .6 less, and OKC .4 less.

It's not just turnovers.

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#170 Majesty

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Posted December 12, 2012 - 02:22 PM

Ok, I got one.

The Lakers are the 2nd to worst team in terms of committing turnovers. You know who else is in the bottom 1/3 in the league? San Antonio, OKC, and Golden State. All 3 have much better records right now.

San Antonio only averages 1.1 less, Golden State .6 less, and OKC .4 less.

It's not just turnovers.


Pull up the stats for scoring off turnovers and see which team pays for it more. :)

And the Spurs are extremely deep, deeper than us, but it's going to catch up with them(have you been watching lately that they have to score at about 130 points just to win games while other teams are scoring in the 110 range? Yeah good luck with that lasting)

OKC has two players that can score 35-40 on any given night and have a guy that can come off the bench that sucks at defense but can give you 20 consistently. Call me when we have any of that.

And Golden State, I think we all know it isn't going to last. Just a matter of when to be honest.

Yet and still, all of those teams have better point guards that run the offense correctly. Take their 3rd and 4th string point guards and tell them to run their offense and see how things turn out.

That means injure Tony Parker, injure Russell Westbrook and take Steph Curry off the Warriors then see how each of those teams go while putting up similar numbers

People disregard that so easily.

Fact of the matter is we're at that weakest position because one, our first and 2nd string point guards that know the offense are injured. And two, we have to have 3 to 4 people bringing the ball up the court at the time because of that. And consider the fact we only lose by a whopping 5 points a game and our turnover problem seems more apparent.

If you want to argue schematics with me, make sure you bring ALL factors.

Edited by Majesty, December 12, 2012 - 02:41 PM.

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#171 Windu

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Posted December 12, 2012 - 02:23 PM

Ok, I got one.

The Lakers are the 2nd to worst team in terms of committing turnovers. You know who else is in the bottom 1/3 in the league? San Antonio, OKC, and Golden State. All 3 have much better records right now.

San Antonio only averages 1.1 less, Golden State .6 less, and OKC .4 less.

It's not just turnovers.


this is what I was talking about the other day

Pau Gasol is GONE


#172 Japago

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Posted December 12, 2012 - 02:40 PM

Pull up the stats for scoring off turnovers and see which team pays for it more. :)


Can't find it, but it does mention it in each individual game box score on ESPN.com.

There have been plenty of games where OKC and San Antonio have given up a lot of points off of turnovers and still won.

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#173 Majesty

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Posted December 12, 2012 - 02:41 PM

Can't find it, but it does mention it in each individual game box score on ESPN.com.

There have been plenty of games where OKC and San Antonio have given up a lot of points off of turnovers and still won.


Didn't think so, so here's some more for you

And the Spurs are extremely deep, deeper than us, but it's going to catch up with them(have you been watching lately that they have to score at about 130 points just to win games while other teams are scoring in the 110 range? Yeah good luck with that lasting)

OKC has two players that can score 35-40 on any given night and have a guy that can come off the bench that sucks at defense but can give you 20 consistently. Call me when we have any of that.

And Golden State, I think we all know it isn't going to last. Just a matter of when to be honest.

Yet and still, all of those teams have better point guards that run the offense correctly. Take their 3rd and 4th string point guards and tell them to run their offense and see how things turn out.

That means injure Tony Parker, injure Russell Westbrook and take Steph Curry off the Warriors then see how each of those teams go while putting up similar numbers

People disregard that so easily.

Fact of the matter is we're at that weakest position because one, our first and 2nd string point guards that know the offense are injured. And two, we have to have 3 to 4 people bringing the ball up the court at the time because of that. And consider the fact we only lose by a whopping 5 points a game and our turnover problem seems more apparent.

If you want to argue schematics with me, make sure you bring ALL factors. When you look at what we have, the determining factor in our losses has been our turnovers above all else. 5 points a game. You know what 5 points a game on average means? Other teams have a larger margin of error because of their deepness. We however have 2 of our main 4 not playing and one that's played 1 and a half games with us that is basically built for this offense.

DO any of that to the Warriors, OKC and the Spurs and tell me what their record becomes.

All schemantics. Not just "some"

I swear some of the arguments people make you'd think that Nash has played this entire season and that Gasol is back to averaging 17/10 and we're still losing.

NOPE!

Edited by Majesty, December 12, 2012 - 02:46 PM.

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#174 Japago

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Posted December 12, 2012 - 02:45 PM

If you want to argue schematics with me, make sure you bring ALL factors.


If you want to, you can look up each individual box score and average out all of the points of off turnovers.

I'm pretty sure San Antonio and OKC give up almost as much as LA.

Watching the games, I'm pretty confident cutting down on turnovers isn't going to turn the Lakers from an awful team to a championship team.

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#175 alec613

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Posted December 12, 2012 - 02:46 PM

LeBron's step dad + bipolar disorder >> Blake + Morris + Duhon

Save us, Papa West :bow:

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#176 Majesty

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Posted December 12, 2012 - 02:50 PM

If you want to, you can look up each individual box score and average out all of the points of off turnovers.

I'm pretty sure San Antonio and OKC give up almost as much as LA.

Watching the games, I'm pretty confident cutting down on turnovers isn't going to turn the Lakers from an awful team to a championship team.


It won't turn them into a championship team.

But take away 3 turnovers from our team and our record only turns out 3 or 4 losses. And that is WITHOUT Nash or Gasol. Like I said you aren't factoring all those things in at all.

And sure break down how many points on average are scored off of turnovers when comparing those teams, I would love to know ;) Then factor that in by our loss margin and see how "little" they mean in terms of everything.

We know it isn't going to last with the Warriors, The Spurs have had to score 130 lately to win games and are deeper as their 3rd and 4th stringers can give Miami a run for their money... that's just something we don't have and it'd be silly to look for. And OKC has two players that can go off for 68 of their teams points. We don't have that either and all have their point guards in tact. Put the 3rd and 4th string point guards and make them the 1st and 2nd pg options on each of those teams and tell me their record. That means factor in the scoring and assists of those point guards in combination with their turnovers. And then compare it to ours because we have 3 to 4 people designated to bring the ball up the court.

I think you'll be quite surprised. I won't be.

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#177 iDreamShake

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Posted December 12, 2012 - 02:53 PM

If you want to, you can look up each individual box score and average out all of the points of off turnovers.

I'm pretty sure San Antonio and OKC give up almost as much as LA.

Watching the games, I'm pretty confident cutting down on turnovers isn't going to turn the Lakers from an awful team to a championship team.


youre right,,but essentially ,more possessions will make us a championship team,,its not just about the turnovers tho,of course..

100% dwight gets us more offensive rebounds,,,and he gets us more defesnive rebounds,we're giving up alot of offensive rebounds.(also 100% dwight lowers opponents fg%))
and nash limits our turnovers

with our main guys 100% roles will be reversed,we will be the team with what seems like too many chances to score,,so our ppg and oppg will improve

Kobe and Randle led Lakers lead the team to a 32-50 record. the Lakers select Myles Turner with the 5th pick.


#178 Majesty

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Posted December 12, 2012 - 02:56 PM

youre right,,but essentially ,more possessions will make us a championship team,,its not just about the turnovers tho,of course..

100% dwight gets us more offensive rebounds,,,and he gets us more defesnive rebounds,we're giving up alot of offensive rebounds.(also 100% dwight lowers opponents fg%))
and nash limits our turnovers

with our main guys 100% roles will be reversed,we will be the team with what seems like too many chances to score,,so our ppg and oppg will improve


Yep not just that but Nash also gets us better shots. So those "more possessions" less are empty, and also allow us to get back on defense in a much better way.

So yeah we get more posessions but we also get more posessions where we get good shots, and getting good shots means less forced opportunities which won't allow other teams to get out on the break against us so often. So yeah we get more possessions but we also get to set up our half court defense more often. Which means a lot more than people give it credit for.

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#179 KjaX24

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Posted December 12, 2012 - 02:58 PM

We should just trade Duhon + Blake for Rose, maybe throw in Ebanks as the corner piece of the deal.
How could the bulls say no?

#180 Majesty

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Posted December 12, 2012 - 03:01 PM

Reporter links Delonte West to the Lakers





Delonte West, seen here with Dallas Mavericks coach Rick Carlisle, was waived by Dallas Mavericks to make room for Eddy Curry. (Tony Gutierrez / Associated Press / October 17, 2012)
By Eric Pincus
December 12, 2012, 6:17 a.m.
The Lakers are in a form of free-fall, losing their third straight game Tuesday night to the Cleveland Cavaliers. As they wait for Pau Gasol (knees) and Steve Nash (leg), is there anything to be done to staunch the bleeding?
According to the Twitter timeline of Marc Stein of ESPN.com, the Lakers are "weighing the pros and cons of creating [a] roster spot to sign Delonte West."
Stein notes that West is "at the top of the Lakers' list," but that he's heard the Lakers will "indeed look around."
West was recently waived by the Dallas Mavericks after a number of team conduct violations.
Stein also lists Mike James and Jonny Flynn as possibilities, although those names appear to be speculative.
If the Lakers were to add a free agent, a player would need to be cut first. The team isn't pleased with the development of Devin Ebanks, who was arrested last month on suspicion of DUI.
Ebanks has a guaranteed salary but rookies Robert Sacre and Darius Johnson-Odom do not. The Lakers would prefer to make a trade to open a roster spot but given how poorly the team has fared recently, perhaps an emergency move will be made to hold the team over for Nash's return.


So it looks like they want to rid themselves of Ebanks before cutting Sacre and Odom. Interesting.

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