63 replies to this topic

[King Joseph]

I'm off from work today so I have the privledge to watch early sportscenter before I go ball and workout later. Everyone is debating is Kobe top 5 of all time and it kind've reminded me how hard it is to make a top 5. You got MJ, Larry, Dr. J (Would've had 30,000 if ABA points counted), E. Baylor, Tim Duncan, Kobe, Shaq, Magic, Kareem, Jerry West, Bill Russel, Wilt, Karl Malone, Moses Malone, LeBron will be as his legacy cemented, Oscor Robertson, Hakeem, and probably a few I might've missed. I personally would choose.

1. MJ
2. Kareem
3. Wilt
4. Oscer Robertson
5. Is tooooooooooooooooooooo Debatable but I might go with Russel cus he dominated his era like no one else.

Kobe will probably pass up magic and all thats gonna hold up LeBron is rings. 27 7 7 and 3 - 6 Rings over a long period (Thats if he's lucky like kobe and Mj to stay healthy) will easily be top 5. But I wanna hear what you guys think and I understand its a generational thing. I'm 18 turning 19 so I didn't get a chance to see the all time greats of those years and all i've seen is 90's and 2000's. So I'm expecting alot've different list.There is no wrong list cause its all opinion and is emensley debatable. But the fact Kobe is even considered top 5 is such a acomplishment. I don't usually post that much cuz I'm busy alot but I really wanna hear you guys opinion so sound off.

Edited by King Joseph, December 06, 2012 - 04:29 PM.

[Cowboys&LakersFan]

I don't see how anyone cannot have Kobe in their top 5 when you take everything into account. Accomplishments, statistics, longevity, etc.

[LakeShow805]

i have kobe at 4

[Massacre]

Uh, yes. Easily.

Jordan
Abdul-Jabbar
Kobe / Wilt
Magic

Kobe moves into 3rd (and past Wilt) when he moves into 4th (and past Wilt) on the all-time scoring list.

6 rings and he's into 2nd.

7 rings and you do the math.

[djcovi]

The responses are based on personal opinion so much it's hard not to take any heat for who you have haha. I'll give it a shot though.

When I think of top 5 players I think of who I would want in the prime of their career. So hypothetically if I were building a team it would be

First team
MJ
Magic
Karl Malone
Shaq
Lebron

Second team
Kobe
Stockton
Duncan
Hakeem
Bird

Yes, Lebron is my first team small forward. Sorry, but he will go down as a better player than anyone else at that position. The only reason I don't have Kobe first team is because MJ is the greatest, and no Kareem because I believe Shaq is the most dominant player ever and Hakeem the most skilled center.

And I do think Kobe is top 5, I'm just not sure where. Probably MJ, Magic, Kareem, Kobe, and Shaq in some order. That's just my opinion though, I'm not real big on guys like Dr J and Wilt and Jerry West. Legends, no doubt, but I think they would get dominated by later more athletic generations.

Bring the hate lol.

Edited by djcovi, December 06, 2012 - 05:07 PM.

[Drazard]

My one and only hall of fame Kobe Bryant !

[King Joseph]

Uh, yes. Easily.

Jordan
Abdul-Jabbar
Kobe / Wilt
Magic

Kobe moves into 3rd (and past Wilt) when he moves into 4th (and past Wilt) on the all-time scoring list.

6 rings and he's into 2nd.

7 rings and you do the math.

In that case Bill is number 1 without discussion lol Even if kobe gets 7 he still won't pass MJ, and he won't pass kareem in my mind. His biggest peak on my list is maybe 3 or 4. But LeBron has a big chance since you brought up pontential, will probably as time goes on bump him out the top 5. LeBron will eclipse Kobe as the youngest to reach 30,000 with lesser games, and his overall statistics will be better (Fg percentage, assist, rebounds, steals, blocks) and if he gets at least 4 rings, conversation might be over. But the funny thing is Kobe career isn't over, so imagine what he has left under his sleeve. But rightnow i think He's number 6 as of today.

1.MJ
2.Kareem
3.Wilt
4.Robertson
5.Russel
6. Kobe
7.Magic

[Windu]

MJ, Wilt, Kobe, Magic, Kareem

[Lakers4Life]

Top 5 of all time should be on career not "prime" years because in their primes players have done great things. For me Shaq isnt top 5 simply because he could have dominated for 15 years instead he dominated for about 7 or 8.

The all-time list has to factor in championships, MVPs, Allstars, scorign numbers, defensive numbers and most importantly longetivity at being the TOP

1. Jordan
2. Kareem
3. Russell
4. Magic Johnson
5. Kobe
6.Wilt Chamberlain
7. Duncan
8. Oscar
9. Bird
10. Shaq
11. Honorable mention Jerry West
Alot of numbers can be shifted 1 up and 1 down (except Jordan).. But thats as accurate as I can get it...

If you look at my top 5, every one of those players dominated their eras
Jordan the 90s with 6 championships
Kareem had one of the longest careers with 6 MVPs and 6 Championships, he dominated from the 70s to the mid 80's
Russell had 11 championship rings and dominated the entire 60's the only reason why his not first or 2nd is simply because he played in a watered down league of 8 teams, but still amazing in its own sense
Magic dominated the 80's he had 7 final appereances, 5 rings and 3 MVPS
Kobe dominated from 00's with 7 final appaerances, 5 rings


Point to add I hate to admit this but I see Lebron suprassing Kobe eventually on this list. His going for his 4th MVP this year lol (and is the front runner atm), if he pulls off about 3-4 championships he will go ahead of Kobe I think.

Edited by Lakers4Life, December 06, 2012 - 05:42 PM.

[Massacre]

In that case Bill is number 1 without discussion lol

Missed my point. No where did I say rings=higher all-time rank. Wilt is placed higher than Kobe and Magic who both have a handful of rings compared to his 2.

The five players I listed (Kobe, Jordan, Kareem, Wilt, Magic) are in a class (tier) or their own. That's who Kobe is competing with.

Kobe, Jordan and Kareem are my top 3 and they might be interchangeable to anyone else making a list. I probably wouldn't bother debating someone changing my order because all 5 make a great case for themselves (Jordan being the overwhelming favorite to me).

[Massacre]

And can a couple of you please explain your fascination with Oscar Robertson and Bill Russell ...

[Hero]

Easily top 3. After he retires, top 2.

[King Joseph]

And can a couple of you please explain your fascination with Oscar Robertson and Bill Russell ...

Missed my point. No where did I say rings=higher all-time rank. Wilt is placed higher than Kobe and Magic who both have a handful of rings compared to his 2.

The five players I listed (Kobe, Jordan, Kareem, Wilt, Magic) are in a class (tier) or their own. That's who Kobe is competing with.

Kobe, Jordan and Kareem are my top 3 and they might be interchangeable to anyone else making a list. I probably wouldn't bother debating someone changing my order because all 5 make a great case for themselves (Jordan being the overwhelming favorite to me).

lol i was being sarcastic bro relax, but i agree with your points and the fascination with Russel is becus he has 11 Rings and defeated arguably the most dominate player in sports history wilt the stilt on many occations just to name a few and Robertson cus dude averaged a tripple double and thats all i can go by becus i am way to young to see them play (which I have no problem with lol). Idk if you were but thats my 5. Like I said no one is wrong or right, its all opinion.

[King Joseph]

Top 5 of all time should be on career not "prime" years because in their primes players have done great things. For me Shaq isnt top 5 simply because he could have dominated for 15 years instead he dominated for about 7 or 8.

The all-time list has to factor in championships, MVPs, Allstars, scorign numbers, defensive numbers and most importantly longetivity at being the TOP

1. Jordan
2. Kareem
3. Russell
4. Magic Johnson
5. Kobe
6.Wilt Chamberlain
7. Duncan
8. Oscar
9. Bird
10. Shaq
11. Honorable mention Jerry West
Alot of numbers can be shifted 1 up and 1 down (except Jordan).. But thats as accurate as I can get it...

If you look at my top 5, every one of those players dominated their eras
Jordan the 90s with 6 championships
Kareem had one of the longest careers with 6 MVPs and 6 Championships, he dominated from the 70s to the mid 80's
Russell had 11 championship rings and dominated the entire 60's the only reason why his not first or 2nd is simply because he played in a watered down league of 8 teams, but still amazing in its own sense
Magic dominated the 80's he had 7 final appereances, 5 rings and 3 MVPS
Kobe dominated from 00's with 7 final appaerances, 5 rings


Point to add I hate to admit this but I see Lebron suprassing Kobe eventually on this list. His going for his 4th MVP this year lol (and is the front runner atm), if he pulls off about 3-4 championships he will go ahead of Kobe I think.

Love your list and I agree with you about the LeBron perspective which I pointed out earlier, as a Laker fan you were always suppose to down LeBron but over the years I have been the complete oppisite. If He Wanted to he can probably average 34 ppg with 8-9 rebounds and 6 assist if he took more shots but hes such a great team player he has no problem deffering to his teamates, and enjoys them scoring. Can guard all 5 positions and 1 - 4 effecively. Alot've people hate on Kobe to the point where they forget how great he is and I never wanted to do that to LeBron. I think if he stays healthy he has a chance to win 3 - 4 more MVP's 3 - 5 more rings and DPOY award, get to 35,000 points and can run at the all time scoring list. Kobe has always been that dude in my basketball life but LeBron will pass him up on most alltime list as His and Kobe career is over I'm predicting.

[reryo]

Love your list and I agree with you about the LeBron perspective which I pointed out earlier, as a Laker fan you were always suppose to down LeBron but over the years I have been the complete oppisite. If He Wanted to he can probably average 34 ppg with 8-9 rebounds and 6 assist if he took more shots but hes such a great team player he has no problem deffering to his teamates, and enjoys them scoring. Can guard all 5 positions and 1 - 4 effecively. Alot've people hate on Kobe to the point where they forget how great he is and I never wanted to do that to LeBron. I think if he stays healthy he has a chance to win 3 - 4 more MVP's 3 - 5 more rings and DPOY award, get to 35,000 points and can run at the all time scoring list. Kobe has always been that dude in my basketball life but LeBron will pass him up on most alltime list as His and Kobe career is over I'm predicting.

Lets hope our Lakers or the Thunder can prevent that.

[King Joseph]

Lets hope our Lakers or the Thunder can prevent that.

Aha I hope so to man.

[fido]

Magic Johnson
Michael Jordan
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
Wilt Chamberlain
Oscar Robertson

Robertson had one, if not more (because the official stats weren't kept, although "soft" stats were) seasons where he AVERAGED a triple double. Russell was a completely dominant force on the court, and was a part of 11 championships, all of which he contributed heavily.

Not yet, but the guy is still playing. Still can't see how you can possibly rank someone that is still active against those who have retired. His career is ongoing. Only when he's done can you place him.

** Duncan above Robertson, Bird and West!? Shaq above Jerry West!? Shaq isn't even in the top 10. Man, some of you younger guys have got to learn history and go watch or read about what the guys before your time did. Time may soften what some older players did, but it shouldn't soften anyone's desire for knowledge before they make such a list or soften someone's appreciation of the skill level those who set the bar had. Some of the top scorers in history (Jerry West rushing to mind first) achieved their status and totals playing a good part (if not all) of their career WITHOUT a 3 point line and playing far less games, while shooting a majority of their shots from range.

[King Joseph]

Magic Johnson
Michael Jordan
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
Wilt Chamberlain
Oscar Robertson

Robertson had one, if not more (because the official stats weren't kept, although "soft" stats were) seasons where he AVERAGED a triple double. Russell was a completely dominant force on the court, and was a part of 11 championships, all of which he contributed heavily.

Not yet, but the guy is still playing. Still can't see how you can possibly rank someone that is still active against those who have retired. His career is ongoing. Only when he's done can you place him.

** Duncan above Robertson, Bird and West!? Shaq above Jerry West!? Shaq isn't even in the top 10. Man, some of you younger guys have got to learn history and go watch or read about what the guys before your time did. Time may soften what some older players did, but it shouldn't soften anyone's desire for knowledge before they make such a list or soften someone's appreciation of the skill level those who set the bar had. Some of the top scorers in history (Jerry West rushing to mind first) achieved their status and totals playing a good part (if not all) of their career WITHOUT a 3 point line and playing far less games, while shooting a majority of their shots from range.

Best post so far. Agree on all your points.

[fido]

Thanks King Joseph.

I just want everyone to know that I don't disregard Kobe's accomplishments so far, I just can't see how you can possibly rank a an active player at all.

[Lakers4Life]

Jerry West Drops fido simply because he only 1 championship. Although denied by an amazing Celtics team at the end of the day Championships count on an "all time" list you need something to distinguish players. Its hard as it is to distinguish between Kobe and Jerry West as players because they played in such different eras, however statistics and numbers (in accomplishments) helps vaults players up the list.

Same goes for Oscar although he is 8th on my list his probably a "better" player but his accomplishments (1 mvp + 1 Championship) bring him down off the all time list.

Thats why its so subjective, how do you judge players over 60 years of basketball? Accomplishments, skill, and stats. How do you compare skills from a player today and a player from 50 years ago? You simply cant. So I try combine all factors together to come up with the most accurate list.