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What do you think about Kobe's defense?


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#61 lildvl10

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Posted December 06, 2012 - 03:40 AM

finally, someone manned up and said something about kobe's defense!! i guess kobe now knows whats wrong with his defense at times.. i just hope it doesnt become a big issue in the long run

#62 lakersince75

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Posted December 06, 2012 - 03:57 AM

People don't realize that even Jordans defense wasn't great at this age. No one plays lock down defense at 33 or 34. Just because this guy paces himself doesn't make him terrible. If he didn't have to carry the load on offense as he does just maybe he could play more D. I'd like to see any NBA SG at 34 with crap knees play this well. Wade, Hardaway, Reggie Miller, McGrady etc. None did or do. Just remember players don't retire when they can't play offense, they retire due to lack of defensive reflexes. Ask Jordan when Allen Iverson started to make him look pitiful #2 If the rest of the team would step up their games maybe MD could find a way to only have to play Kobe 32 or 33 minutes per game and he could play more lockdown defense

Edited by lakersince75, December 06, 2012 - 04:02 AM.


#63 mikel24242

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Posted December 06, 2012 - 03:39 PM

The offense was less crap when he was getting 8-9 assists a game by setting other people up and not shooting over 25 times a game. We barely even give Dwight the ball either. He needs touches and he'll get up 20+ points a night on 9-10 shots


We do give it to howard. Just not in the 4th.... which we cant do, because he cant make freethrows. If he did he would get it in the 4th.
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#64 mikel24242

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Posted December 06, 2012 - 03:40 PM

The offense was less crap when he was getting 8-9 assists a game by setting other people up and not shooting over 25 times a game. We barely even give Dwight the ball either. He needs touches and he'll get up 20+ points a night on 9-10 shots


We do give it to howard. Just not in the 4th.... which we cant do, because he cant make freethrows. If he did he would get it in the 4th.
"As far as me hitting a wall, so what if I did? I didn't, but so what if i did." - Kobe
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#65 gque24

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Posted December 06, 2012 - 03:50 PM

obviously Kobe was not playing defense in 1st half. we all know Kobe gambles & likes to play the passing lanes. but I think he really didnt play defense so he could have enough energy to win the gm in 2nd half. Fortunately we didnt need him in the 2nd half to go overboard. Dont forget we got OKC coming up. Kobe has been going so hard trying to force W's for this squad lately he was due to have some leg fatigue. the only thing that was odd in NO gm was how many dunks Kobe had. cuz it seemed like he was laboring the knee on defense but had the dog tongue wagging on O with some lift for the dunks.
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#66 steven v

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Posted December 07, 2012 - 12:58 PM

Kobe has been playing bad defense. He chooses to leave his man too much and then gets lost. Then he acts like it was someone else's fault that they didn't pick up his man.
The Lakers FO knows more than you. Sorry.

#67 Majesty

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Posted December 07, 2012 - 01:11 PM

Kobe has been playing bad defense. He chooses to leave his man too much and then gets lost. Then he acts like it was someone else's fault that they didn't pick up his man.




The Lakers have been better defensively with Bryant on the floor (allowing 97.8 points per 100 possessions) than with Howard on the floor (99.5)


Care to retract that statement?

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#68 lakersince75

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Posted December 10, 2012 - 05:32 AM

Hopefully when Nash comes back Kobe won't have to handle the ball as much nor play as much and that may help with how much energy he can spend on D

#69 TheOriginalCZM

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Posted December 10, 2012 - 06:59 AM

Kobe really annoys me when he leaves his guy and starts to roam the floor on defense...dude this is not your 2007 team....there is no Lamar Odom out there to have your back so you must stick to your man....and a lot of times he doesn't even close out on his guy, he'll just make a fake and let him take wide open shots like he doesn't even believe he will make the shot.I know Dwight get's pissed off about.

#70 AirTupac

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Posted December 10, 2012 - 09:20 AM

I don't get how some Laker fans ignore this issue. Kobe constantly leaves his man wide open and often gets burned.
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#71 Notorious Arab

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Posted December 10, 2012 - 11:14 AM

I don't get how some Laker fans ignore this issue. Kobe constantly leaves his man wide open and often gets burned.


90% of Lakers fans ignore this.

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#72 Japago

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Posted December 10, 2012 - 11:25 AM

Kobe needs to leave his man though because the initial defense isn't getting it done. When player get into paint or get wide open, the instinct is to at least force another pass.

The Lakers can't defend on the ball. The team is too reliant on help D, and the Lakers are starting to get burned because teams know the Lakers are going to need help on a lot of possessions and they find the open guy.

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#73 MDI

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Posted December 10, 2012 - 11:50 AM

http://www.forumblue...de-kobe-bryant/

Last week, before the OKC game, I was asked whether the Lakers’ bigger problems were on offense or on defense. To me, this answer was, and remains, clear. It’s the defense.

The Lakers’ have fundamental problems on D, mostly related to denying dribble penetration and how they don’t always help the helper. Any team can make the first rotation just fine, but the difference between a solid defense and an elite one is the ability to make the second and third rotation on any given possession. Right now, the Lakers don’t make those late possession rotations very well and they’re paying for it.

But those are the big picture issues. On an individual level, this defense is failing countless times over the course of the game. And while no one is immune, there are players whose bad habits are sticking out like a sore thumb. And while it may be difficult for some people to hear, one of the chief culprits is Kobe Bryant.

Mr. Bean may be playing his heart out on offense (we’ll get to this later) but he’s not showing that same commitment to the defensive side of the ball. There are multiple possessions each game in which he makes fundamental mistakes and it’s costing the Lakers. Again, he’s not alone. But as a leader of the team, he needs to be doing better.

One of Kobe’s chief mistakes is that he gets caught watching the ball too often:




On this play, Kobe is playing on the weak side and his man (Gordon Hayward) is in the corner. Kobe is intently watching the ball on the strong side wing while peeking at the action in the paint to see if the ball is going to be whipped into one of the Jazz big men off their interior screen action. While all that’s happening, Hayward cut back door. Kobe, never once looking at his man, only reacted to the pass and fouled a mid-air Hayward who was trying to make the catch.

At the lowest levels of organized basketball, players are asked to see the ball and their man. Kobe loses his man at the very start of this possession and never found him again until committing the foul.

Kobe also has a nasty habit of watching the ball and going for steals that aren’t that likely, and compromising the rest of the defense in the process:






On this play Kobe is guarding DeMarre Carroll, who starts on the strong side but then drifts to the weak side as the Jazz run a sideline P&R. Once Carroll clears the side, Kobe again is mostly watching the ball and cheating towards Enes Kanter who is setting up for a mid-range jumper. The ball never goes to Kanter, however, and instead is skipped to Carroll spotting up on the wing. Kobe tries to steal the pass, fails, and then doesn’t recover to Carroll quick enough to deny penetration. Meeks, hoping to try and play two players, cheats off the strong side corner (a cardinal sin in basketball) to help on Carroll. Like Kobe, Meeks is unsuccessful in slowing Carroll but also gives up the pass to the corner. Hayward makes the Lakers pay by hitting the wide open three.

Kobe’s mistakes here aren’t so drastic but he made several on that single play. Going for the steal was likely the worst offense since it put him in a position where he couldn’t contain the penetration of his man. Scouting tells you that Carroll isn’t a three point shooter so denying his drive is the number one goal of defending him. Once Kobe let Carroll get by him, the greater integrity of the defense was compromised and that was that.

On this last possession, Kobe simply plays a lazy brand of defense that hurt the Lakers on two separate occasions:




This play starts with Kobe on the left baseline guarding Randy Foye. The Jazz run a screen action to free Foye coming across the lane. When Ron’s man comes to screen Kobe, you see him not want to fight through the pick and calls out a late switch to Ron. This leads to Foye getting a wide open jumper that Ron barely contested due to the timing of the switch. To make matters worse, after switching onto Marvin Williams, Kobe didn’t box out and allowed Williams to sneak underneath Howard to tip in the missed shot. Two lazy plays on one possession for Kobe, there.

While I’m singling out Kobe here, he’s not the only one playing this way. On one of the first plays of the game, Ron got beat on an alley oop to Marvin Williams where he was watching the ball similar to Kobe in the first clip. I could have put up multiple clips of Jamison losing his man on screens and getting beat off the dribble, not only from the Jazz game but from every game this season. If the Lakers’ defensive problems were a one man issue, that would be simple enough. They’re not and that complicates matters a great deal.

What further complicates things is that Kobe is a major culprit. His off ball defense stands out as particularly poor this year. He’s gambling for steals, losing sight of his man, and roaming in ways that make the team’s defense structurally unsound. In essence, Kobe is making the easy choice way too often rather than making the harder play that is more taxing physically.

In a way, this is easy to understand. Kobe is playing heavy minutes (44 hard ones against the Jazz) and is carrying a tremendous burden on offense. The energy he’s expending on that side of the ball is massive and to think that won’t affect him in other areas would be a silly conclusion, especially for a 17 year veteran. That said, he’s clearly coasting on defense in order to conserve energy on offense and that simply won’t do. Not only does it hurt the team in countless tangible ways, it sets a bad example for how the team needs to play on that end of the floor.

Dwight Howard was brought in to help solve some of the Lakers’ defensive woes. And, he too can be better than he has been. But he can’t make up for everyone’s mistakes. Jamison and Duhon are turnstiles on D. Ron is getting beat more this season than in year’s past. And Kobe, as shown, isn’t holding up his end of the bargain. As a leader and a yearly member of the all-defensive team, he needs to be better.


Edited by MDI, December 10, 2012 - 11:56 AM.

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Props to sidthekid871


#74 Nak

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Posted December 10, 2012 - 12:04 PM

His defense is subpar to say the least, but you can't blame Kobe right now as he is 34 years old. He is the only Laker who shows pride and passion for the game on a nightly basis.

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#75 steven v

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Posted December 10, 2012 - 12:19 PM

Care to retract that statement? [/size]


No.. Kobe leaves his man too much. He is playing bad defense..
The Lakers FO knows more than you. Sorry.

#76 mrclutch

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Posted December 10, 2012 - 12:50 PM

That entire article MDI just posted pretty much
Cancels out any stats ANYONE here feels free to post.... Kobe has been a bad defender for the most part to start this season and it doesn't take a genius to see and figure it out.

#77 AirTupac

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Posted December 10, 2012 - 01:16 PM

Anyone who ISN'T biased can clearly tell you that Kobe's defense has been really subpar this season. He'll pick it up when Nash comes back, less work for him offensively leaves him with more energy on the defensive end. But I cringe everytime I see Kobe's man wide open.
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#78 Real Deal

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Posted December 10, 2012 - 01:40 PM

The fact is this: the SG position, when Kobe is in the game, has an eFG% of 44.4% and a PER of 11.2.

You can swing that however you like, inaccurately, but in addition to that, we are 23rd in allowed three-point attempts, and 9th in defending the three-point line.

The numbers are slightly decreasing (three-point line defense, and Kobe's allowed PER), but not significantly enough to judge why we were struggling over the first 10-15 games of the season.

All of the "biased" garbage I keep reading...well, you just don't have answers, so you're taking the easy way out by citing a couple of defensive lapses each game. If I was biased, I wouldn't have a problem with all of Kobe's turnovers (he is leading the team, at nearly 3.8 TO/G) or his 44% shooting over the last five games or so.

Dwight Howard had three big defensive lapses against Orlando, by the way. I SHOULD go and point them out, like a jackass, but the truth is, those defensive mistakes don't make him a bad defensive player.

This is the Los Angeles Lakers fanbase. You can't tell me I'm surprised. It has happened every single year I've been a fan, even when we win championships.

#79 Real Deal

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Posted December 10, 2012 - 01:51 PM

First video, not his fault. There was a screen coming, something Utah does a LOT down low to free up their bigs and wings, and Kobe has to be in that position + give up the three if necessary. Under Brown, and most every coach, you give up the three before you do the high-percentage basket, and that's why the Lakers have been in the top 10 in overall FG% all season long, and shockingly, top 10 in three-point percentage.

Second video, Kobe should not have gambled there, and he was getting beat to the rim. His fault.

Third video, the Lakers are asked to switch all the time, and even if it wasn't LA we're talking about, if it's that close to the rim, you switch immediately. That's on Ron Artest. Kobe should have boxed out...that part is on him, but even if he didn't, Dwight had nobody around him aside from Mo Williams, so that rebound should have been his.

If you guys seriously think our team can defend players individually, the entire game, without help defense from Kobe and Howard (the two helpers on this roster), you're sadly mistaken. You're giving guys like Gasol, Jamison, Morris, Duhon, Meeks, and even Hill far too much credit.

#80 last stand 2.0

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Posted December 10, 2012 - 03:22 PM

agree kobe isn't playing "great" defense, but hill was embarassed by kanter, meeks hustles but doesn't consistently produce defensively, duhon and morris are lol most of the time, artest and ebanks are open doors, jamison is lol, and pau was lol

the real issue is ron artest tbh. he's playing really poor defense lately and his offense as usual is week to week
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