81 replies to this topic

[JGuez]

no, my argument is against your point that kobe was a "major reason" we lost this game. he was not. like i said and will continue to say, he played a role, specifically the 10 turnovers, but the MAJOR reasons we lost were piss poor field goal and free throw percentage, and 0 contributions from the bench.

Piss poor field goal percentage comes from a lack of a facilitator.....

What part do you not get?

[androsays]

so it's kobe's fault that whenever a teammate got the ball, regardless of whether the ball was coming from kobe or another teammate, they would miss?

5 of [expletive]in 38 speaks for itself.

[JGuez]

so it's kobe's fault that whenever a teammate got the ball, regardless of whether the ball was coming from kobe or another teammate, they would miss?

5 of [expletive]in 38 speaks for itself.

Of course not but Kobe didn't try to get people the ball which is my entire point.

The 10 turnovers and 10 more shot attempts than his normal amount speaks for itself in what his goal for the night was.

He was not passing the ball. Did you even watch the game?

[West Coast]

Piss poor field goal percentage comes from a lack of a facilitator.....

What part do you not get?

Well tonight we missed a lot of wide open shots. Metta had about 4 threes go in and out, Jamison missed a couple open shots and so did Meeks.

The wide open looks need to be made. When Nash is back there will be even more open looks so these guys need to make them.

[Cowboys&LakersFan]

Of course not but Kobe didn't try to get people the ball which is my entire point.

The 10 turnovers and 10 more shot attempts than his normal amount speaks for itself in what his goal for the night was.

He was not passing the ball. Did you even watch the game?

Did you watch the game? Kobe was phenomal. Sick as a dog and still put up 40 points and 10 boards. He had alot of turnovers, but more than made up for it with his terrific play offensively, defensively, and on the boards. Blaming him for tonight's loss is just absurd. He's the only reason this was even a contest.

[androsays]

Of course not but Kobe didn't try to get people the ball which is my entire point.

The 10 turnovers and 10 more shot attempts than his normal amount speaks for itself in what his goal for the night was.

He was not passing the ball. Did you even watch the game?

yes, i did. did YOU not see the rest of the team miss 33 out of 38 shots?

[JGuez]

Well tonight we missed a lot of wide open shots. Metta had about 4 threes go in and out, Jamison missed a couple open shots and so did Meeks.

The wide open looks need to be made. When Nash is back there will be even more open looks so these guys need to make them.

Yeah I agree. As a team we shot like [expletive], a lot because these people can't create on their own and they need someone (Kobe or Nash) to do it and others were bad luck. A ton of shots did go in and out but at the end of the day they didn't go in so who cares, right?

Did you watch the game? Kobe was phenomal. Sick as a dog and still put up 40 points and 10 boards. He had alot of turnovers, but more than made up for it with his terrific play offensively, defensively, and on the boards. Blaming him for tonight's loss is just absurd. He's the only reason this was even a contest.

Made 40 points on 42% shooting and 10 turnovers. AMAZING KOBE! SO GOOD!

Question: How many times have we won this season when Kobe has scored 40 points?

Answer: 0 and 2....if you throw in his 38 point game against the Kings it's 0 and 3. Great freaking record to have.

You'd rather have Kobe score more points if it means the team is going to lose? Some fan you are.

yes, i did. did YOU not see the rest of the team miss 33 out of 38 shots?

I did see that but you even agreed earlier...the rest of this team does not create their own shots. Look what happens when they try to. Pau gets blocked 5 times, people take stupid shots out of rhythm and yeah a couple didn't fall in that maybe would have normally got in but we shoot like crap. We NEED a facilitator and Kobe is that guy while Nash is out. The fact that you applaud him for doing the opposite as we lose those games is actually psychotic.

I think you're not understanding something. You can't make the argument that Kobe tried to get people involved when he took 36% of our teams shots and turned the ball over 10 times (52% of our teams TOs). Even watching the game you could see him demanding the ball and not passing it out.

Look guys....I get the fact that Kobe was sick but if he's going to put all that effort into the game then freaking get people involved. We play better as a team when someone is facilitating and the stats do not lie.

[L.A.K.E.R]

Kobe's turnovers were bad, but he wasn't the reason we lost. You can credit that to two straight piss poor displays of defense by Pau Gasol on consecutive possessions to close the game. I just re-watched Hill's two made FGA in the final minute. Both times the defender siphoned him to Pau and he did nothing. The first possession had Hill just drive the lane and Pau watched him pass by. No attempt at a contest, just let him waltz right by two feet away. And on the final possession, of course Pau hedges too far and gets beaten off the dribble. He might be one of the worst in the entire league at hedging on picks.

[MrKnowItAll]

I know that Pau hasn't been play good at all, BUT we simply can't blame this loss on him. This was an all around team loss. Both teams played bad, but the lakers just played worse than them.

[Miggs]

This season reminds me of the year we had Atkins butler grant . Kobe was such a ball hog back then. He is becoming to be like that again.

[Miggs]

Kobe needed to sit his ars down this game. F****** tough guy.

[gque24]

^^All u clowns blaming Kobe smack the person u see in the mirror. without Kobe we might have 4 wins. if Pau gave any effort we would be winning these close gms.

[Cowboys&LakersFan]

Yeah I agree. As a team we shot like [expletive], a lot because these people can't create on their own and they need someone (Kobe or Nash) to do it and others were bad luck. A ton of shots did go in and out but at the end of the day they didn't go in so who cares, right?



Made 40 points on 42% shooting and 10 turnovers. AMAZING KOBE! SO GOOD!

Question: How many times have we won this season when Kobe has scored 40 points?

Answer: 0 and 2....if you throw in his 38 point game against the Kings it's 0 and 3. Great freaking record to have.

You'd rather have Kobe score more points if it means the team is going to lose? Some fan you are.



I did see that but you even agreed earlier...the rest of this team does not create their own shots. Look what happens when they try to. Pau gets blocked 5 times, people take stupid shots out of rhythm and yeah a couple didn't fall in that maybe would have normally got in but we shoot like crap. We NEED a facilitator and Kobe is that guy while Nash is out. The fact that you applaud him for doing the opposite as we lose those games is actually psychotic.

I think you're not understanding something. You can't make the argument that Kobe tried to get people involved when he took 36% of our teams shots and turned the ball over 10 times (52% of our teams TOs). Even watching the game you could see him demanding the ball and not passing it out.

Look guys....I get the fact that Kobe was sick but if he's going to put all that effort into the game then freaking get people involved. We play better as a team when someone is facilitating and the stats do not lie.

Do you know how to read? I NEVER said I'd rather see Kobe have a big scoring performance. I simply stated that blaming him is absurd. Yeah he didn't shoot great, but he still got to the line and posted a TS percentage of just under 60 which is phenomenal for a guard. On top of that he pulled down 10 boards whiivh is also phenomenal for a guard. He was the only reason we were even in the game. Kobe did try to facilitate, but the team just missed alot of wide open shots.

[JGuez]

Do you know how to read? I NEVER said I'd rather see Kobe have a big scoring performance. I simply stated that blaming him is absurd. Yeah he didn't shoot great, but he still got to the line and posted a TS percentage of just under 60 which is phenomenal for a guard. On top of that he pulled down 10 boards whiivh is also phenomenal for a guard. He was the only reason we were even in the game. Kobe did try to facilitate, but the team just missed alot of wide open shots.

"Kobe was phenomal. Sick as a dog and still put up 40 points and 10 boards."

So what's the point of this statement? We still lost the game and it's because Kobe didn't facilitate like he does in our wins without Nash.

"Kobe did try to facilitate, but the team just missed alot of wide open shots."

The team did miss a lot of wide open shots, but at the same time Kobe did NOT try to facilitate. He ran into the paint and got stripped....that was almost 10 of the 10 turnovers. What does he do after he gets stripped? He sits there and looks at the refs for a call when they were clean strips.

Stop lying to yourself.

Edited by JGuez, November 28, 2012 - 02:52 PM.

[LakeShow805]

"Kobe was phenomal. Sick as a dog and still put up 40 points and 10 boards."

So what's the point of this statement? We still lost the game and it's because Kobe didn't facilitate like he does in our wins without Nash.

"Kobe did try to facilitate, but the team just missed alot of wide open shots."

The team did miss a lot of wide open shots, but at the same time Kobe did NOT try to facilitate. He ran into the paint and got stripped....that was almost 10 of the 10 turnovers. What does he do after he gets stripped? He sits there and looks at the refs for a call when they were clean strips.

Stop lying to yourself.

Aren't you the guy that believes Kobe will never be as great as Magic and will never be the greatest laker?

[JGuez]

Aren't you the guy that believes Kobe will never be as great as Magic and will never be the greatest laker?

Not me. I think you're confusing me with someone else here.

Edit: Just to add....I love Kobe and think it's obvious he'll end up as the greatest Laker ever....

Edited by JGuez, November 28, 2012 - 03:07 PM.

[LakeShow805]

Not me. I think you're confusing me with someone else here.

Edit: Just to add....I love Kobe and think it's obvious he'll end up as the greatest Laker ever....

oh my bad. theres go my argument lol

[Cowboys&LakersFan]

"Kobe was phenomal. Sick as a dog and still put up 40 points and 10 boards."

So what's the point of this statement? We still lost the game and it's because Kobe didn't facilitate like he does in our wins without Nash.

"Kobe did try to facilitate, but the team just missed alot of wide open shots."

The team did miss a lot of wide open shots, but at the same time Kobe did NOT try to facilitate. He ran into the paint and got stripped....that was almost 10 of the 10 turnovers. What does he do after he gets stripped? He sits there and looks at the refs for a call when they were clean strips.

Stop lying to yourself.

Umm no. We lost the game because we were horrendous from the free throw line, on that final possession defensively, and once again Kobe did try to facilitate, but guys just couldn't hit wide open shots. It was a very ugly game from a shooting perspective. Kobe was getting hammered out there and plenty of times it didn't get called so I understand his frustration with the officials.

Edited by Cowboys&LakersFan, November 28, 2012 - 06:42 PM.

[gque24]

"Kobe was phenomal. Sick as a dog and still put up 40 points and 10 boards."

So what's the point of this statement? We still lost the game and it's because Kobe didn't facilitate like he does in our wins without Nash.

"Kobe did try to facilitate, but the team just missed alot of wide open shots."

The team did miss a lot of wide open shots, but at the same time Kobe did NOT try to facilitate. He ran into the paint and got stripped....that was almost 10 of the 10 turnovers. What does he do after he gets stripped? He sits there and looks at the refs for a call when they were clean strips.

Stop lying to yourself.

If no1 especially Kobe in your mind was the facilitator then how the hell did LA get so many wideopen attempts that they bricked routinely all night? You cant have it both ways. If guys make the damn shots Kobe may have had another triple double! The main reason players get wideopen looks is because Kobe draws the entire opposing team to him & he kicks it out to open man or kicks it & then next man kicks to open man for hockey assist. U recognize above "Pau gets blocked 5 times, people take stupid shots out of rhythm and yeah a couple didn't fall in that maybe would have normally got in but we shoot like crap" = but you dont keep this nor the missed free throws in persepective! You just blame the only guy that almost willed the team to another victory cuz every1 else was lazy & not mentally prepared to play. Hypocrite blame the poor production from those who had pitiful stat lines & pitiful impact on both sides of the ball as well not just the easy usual mark (Kobe)

[JGuez]

If no1 especially Kobe in your mind was the facilitator then how the hell did LA get so many wideopen attempts that they bricked routinely all night? You cant have it both ways. If guys make the damn shots Kobe may have had another triple double! The main reason players get wideopen looks is because Kobe draws the entire opposing team to him & he kicks it out to open man or kicks it & then next man kicks to open man for hockey assist. U recognize above "Pau gets blocked 5 times, people take stupid shots out of rhythm and yeah a couple didn't fall in that maybe would have normally got in but we shoot like crap" = but you dont keep this nor the missed free throws in persepective!

I've stated this multiple times but you can agree that there are only sooo many shot attempts in a game, right? It's obviously a variable depending on the pace of the game, rebounds we're getting, and steals/turnovers. Maybe another few factors that are crossing my mind right now.

Anyways Kobe is normally averaging 18 shot attempts this season. The game in question he averaged 28, an increase of 55%. Not only did he increase his shot attempts, but he took 37% of our team shots. THEN he had 10 turnovers. I don't know if you saw the game or not but a LOT of these turnovers were Kobe running down the lane into 3 or 4 defenders and getting the ball stripped from him.

In our wins this season Kobe is averaging 15.8 shots a game. In our losses he's averaging 20.5 shots a game. Do you honestly not see a correlation?

You cannot make the argument that Kobe facilitated that game with stats because it didn't happen that way. He did not play like the facilitator he has been in the games we win.

You just blame the only guy that almost willed the team to another victory cuz every1 else was lazy & not mentally prepared to play. Hypocrite blame the poor production from those who had pitiful stat lines & pitiful impact on both sides of the ball as well not just the easy usual mark (Kobe)

lol, not sure how that makes me a hypocrite? Just wanted to name call me so said anything that popped into your mind? Classy.

Everyone is to blame in the game, I'm just putting a lot of the blame on Kobe. Since when are the people on this team not named Kobe, Dwight & Pau players who can create their own shot? They aren't and if you watched the game you could tell Kobe was out there to score instead of facilitate. I'm pretty sure he even took the first or second shot (a 3 pointer he made). If you watch the games this season you know that Kobe normally doesn't shoot for a bit and let's the team take shots first. The second he took his shot you just knew it was going to be one of those games.

Here's his shots by quarter:

1st: 7, 2nd: 8, 3rd: 6 4th: 7

He took 15 of his average 18 shot attempts this season in the first half. Looks like a guy who was trying to pass, right?

I respect Kobe. I think how hard he played was commendable, however I think had he put that effort into facilitating and not trying to be a hero we would have easily won this game. In 2 weeks though Kobe wont have to facilitate anymore. He can be the scoring beast he is and not worry about feeding others.