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Coach Update (Pg. 59 - D'Antoni WILL coach tonight)


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#41 last stand 2.0

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Posted November 10, 2012 - 12:45 AM

The whole triangle doesn't need a PG thing is overstated. People point to the triangle never having one until Payton who was awful in it

Well it doesn't need a pg because Phil had guys like pippen, Kobe, MJ to run it

Payton. Well Payton wasn't having it. Payton wanted to score, Payton couldn't shoot

Payton had trouble finding places to score and therefore failed

Nash isn't Payton. And Phil will meet Nash halfway. Phil will let Nash have possessions where he pick and rolls, pushes the pace. But Nash is a complimentary player. He's not one of our go tos. Those are Dwight and Kobe period

Nash is a role player
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#42 GCMD

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Posted November 10, 2012 - 12:46 AM

Umm I clearly mentioned that Kobe didn't have that same spring aka he was playing hurt. You still have to credit Dallas. They played great defense on him and Shawn Marion in particular. They had a great defensive scheme which kept Kobe out of the paint and off the free throw line and forced him to shoot long jumpers. It was a combo of both. He was hurt, but also played against a terrific defense.


You mean Phil was outcoached by Carlisle?

#43 GCMD

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Posted November 10, 2012 - 12:48 AM

The whole triangle doesn't need a PG thing is overstated. People point to the triangle never having one until Payton who was awful in it

Well it doesn't need a pg because Phil had guys like pippen, Kobe, MJ to run it

Payton. Well Payton wasn't having it. Payton wanted to score, Payton couldn't shoot

Payton had trouble finding places to score and therefore failed

Nash isn't Payton. And Phil will meet Nash halfway. Phil will let Nash have possessions where he pick and rolls, pushes the pace. But Nash is a complimentary player. He's not one of our go tos. Those are Dwight and Kobe period

Nash is a role player





Dwight will not be the cog in Phil's Triangle...the offense will be ran thru Kobe and Pau. Let's see how Dwight enjoys that at the end of the season...

#44 last stand 2.0

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Posted November 10, 2012 - 12:48 AM

No I'll just point to the proof that at 70% of his normal self Dwight was scoring with ease in the Princeton as was Kobe which is similar to the triangle.

That is enough proof that Dwight is right for the triangle.
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#45 Jay Cee

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Posted November 10, 2012 - 12:48 AM

You mean Phil was outcoached by Carlisle?


You mean snooty questions asserting your own opinion?

#46 last stand 2.0

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Posted November 10, 2012 - 12:50 AM



Dwight will not be the cog in Phil's Triangle...the offense will be ran thru Kobe and Pau. Let's see how Dwight enjoys that at the end of the season...


Interesting, considering Phil himself said Kobe has to have the ball, Nash has to be allowed to be himself, and dwight has to get the ball

Didn't mention pau, Phil has said the one player he'd want to build a team around was Dwight

But Dwight won't be the cog. Lol ok
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#47 GCMD

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Posted November 10, 2012 - 12:52 AM

No I'll just point to the proof that at 70% of his normal self Dwight was scoring with ease in the Princeton as was Kobe which is similar to the triangle.

That is enough proof that Dwight is right for the triangle.


70% as a finisher, not as a cog that made it work.

Dwight is a finisher. The triangle doesn't have room for a player that can't handle the rock, can't shoot outside of 10 feet and can't be trusted to make decisions (again, the fallacy of Dwight as a good passer vanishes when you look at his A/T...which is horrible).

Dwight should be in P&R and a free-flowing, uptempo offense as a finisher or decoy...anything more is foolish.

#48 muncher

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Posted November 10, 2012 - 12:55 AM

Do you think IF PJ comes back in to coach. He will make adjustments to run an offence that compliments the players he has to work with? I think we all agree that he is a proven coach, so why doubt what he will do would be wrong for the players we have?

TBH, I'm just happy Brown is gone and excited for the weeks to come!

#49 last stand 2.0

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Posted November 10, 2012 - 12:57 AM

70% as a finisher, not as a cog that made it work.

Dwight is a finisher. The triangle doesn't have room for a player that can't handle the rock, can't shoot outside of 10 feet and can't be trusted to make decisions (again, the fallacy of Dwight as a good passer vanishes when you look at his A/T...which is horrible).

Dwight should be in P&R and a free-flowing, uptempo offense as a finisher or decoy...anything more is foolish.


Lol 70% as in athleticism, stamina, lower body strength. Those things are more than just finishing.

And if your watching as opposed to just tossing stats around you'd notice that Dwights turnovers this season have been mostly the ball beings slapped out of his hands when he turns to make a move. Directly tied to being out of shape. He has made very few passing errors

Stats without context are useless
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#50 Majesty

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Posted November 10, 2012 - 01:06 AM

This is Phil, in that Mavs series..



HE'S not the one who failed. HE was all in. Kobe was all in. The rest of the team? Old and tired. They had played in the finals 3 years in a row. They lost to a Mavs team on a mission. Yes, that last season wasn't Phil's best, but Woj is trying to describe them as kind of mediocre. They were still contending. Everyone believed it was the year for a Kobe vs LeBron matchup. Once Mike Brown was hired, OKC got the bigger edge with the media, not the Lakers, even before making the finals.



Call me a blind Laker fan. Call me a homer. I don't care. But that statement is seriously false. Phil coached the way Phil coaches all the time - calmly. If you're going to call that uninterested, you shouldn't be paid to be writing it.


Those of us that watched know that Phil checked out once his team stopped listening to him. He basically said "Don't let them shoot threes and that's it" and they kept falling for the same trick play over and over again and stopped trying.

That is what Kobe was pissed at, the team effort and Phil losing the team.

He'd do better with this lineup for sure but we'll see. I want to see Kobe shooting above 50% like he's been doing so I'd hope Phil would take advantage of having Nash so that Kobe doesnt have to do anything and runs something similar to what he had Jordan do in Chicago in terms of what to do from the 2 position.

That is if he gets the job over D'antoni.

D'antoni would do WONDERS for our bench no doubt. Morris/Blake and Meeks as well as Jamison would have a field day in his offense. Or at least a lot of open looks.

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#51 Real Deal

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Posted November 10, 2012 - 01:09 AM

The triangle doesn't have room for a player that can't handle the rock, can't shoot outside of 10 feet and can't be trusted to make decisions

Longley
Rodman
Wennington
Simpkins

Two starters, two bench players, from the greatest team ever. None of them could shoot (stick a man in Longley's face, and he bricked 15-footers, same with Wennington), none of them made good decisions, all of them were fed by Jordan and Pippen.

Again, the Dwight A/TO ratio is compared to Hakeem's, back when he was in Houston for the first four or five seasons, as a superstar player who dominated every team out there AND led his team to the Finals in his second season. Howard didn't rack up assists because of SVG swinging the ball purposely. This was noted over and over again, by Van Gundy.

You're either skipping over my posts (the one about Howard/Hakeem, and then the one from the first page of this topic), or they just don't need answered, I suppose.

Oh well. Tired of reading the same thing over and over again. Don't worry, I won't bother you anymore.

#52 Cj2008nw

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Posted November 10, 2012 - 01:34 AM

I believe Phil is the best coach for the Lakers.... he is one of the greatest basketball minds of all time.... I'm almost positive he will find a way to utilize everybody on the roster.... I'm not looking into the Triangle Offense right now I'm basing it off of him predicting everything going on in basketball up to his point and has probably even hinted his return... I remember a year ago or a couple months ago he said he would come back to coaching if the right situation presented itself to him... and what better time and situation than now!

#53 fido

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Posted November 10, 2012 - 01:40 AM

Phil is too smart and the team as a whole is too smart to let anything fall through the cracks.

This team is different than Phil's last Laker team who were (self-admittedly) exhausted from their previous runs to the Finals. Comparing the two teams doesn't line up.

If Phil is ready health-wise and the team wants him back (which I would think they all do. Howard and Nash would be ecstatic to have a chance to play under him), then Phil will be the coach by Monday,

#54 Calisupra2nr

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Posted November 10, 2012 - 03:23 AM

The blatant disrespect and blasphemy coming from a couple people here is appalling.

How does anyone not assume that Phil would accommodate Nash properly into the offense? That will be one of the motivations for him coming back...to work with a legendary point guard. To sit here and say, "Oh Phil will be mediocre coming back because he won't utilize Nash and Howard" is a travesty to leave anyone's mouth. Phil wants Howard the most out of ANY player in the NBA. I feel like his basketball IQ will allow for Howard to do OK...

#55 Majesty

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Posted November 10, 2012 - 04:39 AM

You're usually a pretty good poster on here but you are dead wrong on this.

The pieces we have are perfect for the triangle. The Triangle at its best involves ball movement, in and out of the post, around the perimeter. Dwight Howard is arguably the best passing big man in the league right now. Pau Gasol is perfect where he is at and the triangle would move him closer to the basket where he is most effective.

The triangle has never required a true point guard. Nash is very creative and Phil would allow him to run his own sets from time to time with the pick and roll. People forget under Phil how much two man game Kobe and Pau played which was deadly during games. Nash would fit in because he can shoot the ball. Far better shooter than Derek Fisher was in his time here.

Arguments can be made about the SF spot, but we already one a title with Metta there when the triangle was being run so that's not an issue. Ebanks could be really good in the triangle off the bench but he may not be back this season with this DUI thing.

Jamison would thrive in this offense and he will do it off the bench that gives our team a better look and should improve our bench efficiency.

Fisher/Kobe/Ron/Gasol/Bynum.... We won a title with that, why wouldn't Nash/Kobe/Ron/Gasol/Howard not be just as good?

Personally I think you're really underestimating Phil Jackson and his ability to put players in position to succeed. He defines roles and gets players to buy in.



The triangle is basically a less complicated version of the Princeton too(or it's Little Brother if you want to call it that) . So it's not like they'd be learning anything TOO different just not as complicated.

Edited by Majesty, November 10, 2012 - 04:40 AM.

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#56 Windu

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Posted November 10, 2012 - 06:06 AM

You guys need to stop bashing anyone who doesn't mind moving on...not thinking Phil is the best choice for this roster is not a crime.


We tried moving on. Do you remember what happened with that...

Pau Gasol is GONE


#57 MyJohnsonIsMagic

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Posted November 10, 2012 - 06:29 AM

Everything he said is true...and more...

But I'm going to sit back and cash my "I told you so" later...


Just don't fade away if your predictions don't work out ;)

I want Phil back, but I'm starting to doubt again if it will happen.

I could care less though in the end, any other coach the Lakers want to go after is better than Brown by miles.

#58 DameC24

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Posted November 10, 2012 - 07:18 AM

I think everyone is entitled to their position, but my opinion is that Phil is the best coach for this squad. When the squad won three straight from 2000-02, who was the center then? I think we sometimes forget that Phil can work with anyone, and if Dwight buys into the system, Phil will make it work. Also I think Nash will be perfect for the triangle. I don't think he can keep running up and down the court like he's done before. Also it has been mentioned that he's the best shooter on the team, and not only someone will kick it out to him, but chances are he will knock it down. This team needs a championship caliber coach, and D'Antoni does not strike me as such.

Also, the bench is better than it was 2 seasons ago. I hope he's here by Monday :rock:

#59 kfreud

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Posted November 10, 2012 - 08:01 AM

70% as a finisher, not as a cog that made it work.

Dwight is a finisher. The triangle doesn't have room for a player that can't handle the rock, can't shoot outside of 10 feet and can't be trusted to make decisions (again, the fallacy of Dwight as a good passer vanishes when you look at his A/T...which is horrible).

Dwight should be in P&R and a free-flowing, uptempo offense as a finisher or decoy...anything more is foolish.

Yah, the triangle has NEVER had a guy like that...
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#60 DaSmoothOperator

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Posted November 10, 2012 - 08:24 AM

Well as an old dude mydelf, it does weigh on you and the expectation would be a ring no less, pressure but not a factor, still have Pau and will he "Man" up or continue the Euro fall and look around for "somebody help me, that wasn't right , its not fair make him stop" He didn;t actually say that but looks it, wheres the Nadal type attitude, the fearless bullfighter not the Zorro sidekick. Sorry but there is some truth to the angle he took on the story, but before you fire one guy you should know who is next inseason esp. Phils mind may say yr=es but physu=ically and the grind will alter that. Remember "you can't go home again" its true sometimes.




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