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How To Get Off The Upgrade Treadmill And Stop Wasting Money On New Tech


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#21 Windu

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Posted September 17, 2012 - 02:54 PM

we'll see if the consumer is smart

700/800 is too much for the mainstay customers of the sony playstation.

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#22 PhillyLaker24

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Posted September 17, 2012 - 02:59 PM

we'll see if the consumer is smart

700/800 is too much for the mainstay customers of the sony playstation.


The same thing was said when the consoles came out for hundreds of bucks and games cost 60 dollars. But games still cost 60 bucks and both consoles still sold out even with their huge price tags as soon as they came out. People go out and buy it anyway to be the first ones to have it. To me 60 bucks for a game is crazy and I never really buy a game at full price unless I know I will play it for hundreds of hours. However, they still go for that much and people still buy them at full price, hell some people pay 80 bucks for stupid special editions. Do not underestimate how much the average consumer is willing to pay for something just because it is new or the simple fact they just want it. Look at the iphone 5, has sold out already and sold more than any other iphone in history after being announced, even though out of all the models it probably has the least amount of changes to it from the previous model.

Edited by PhillyLaker24, September 17, 2012 - 02:59 PM.

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#23 Windu

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Posted September 17, 2012 - 03:07 PM

The same thing was said when the consoles came out for hundreds of bucks and games cost 60 dollars. But games still cost 60 bucks and both consoles still sold out even with their huge price tags as soon as they came out. People go out and buy it anyway to be the first ones to have it. To me 60 bucks for a game is crazy and I never really buy a game at full price unless I know I will play it for hundreds of hours. However, they still go for that much and people still buy them at full price, hell some people pay 80 bucks for stupid special editions. Do not underestimate how much the average consumer is willing to pay for something just because it is new or the simple fact they just want it. Look at the iphone 5, has sold out already and sold more than any other iphone in history after being announced, even though out of all the models it probably has the least amount of changes to it from the previous model.


That's just the first wave imo. Even I would have paid the price tag when the PS3 first came out. But for 700/800, mutha[expletive]a better be able to cook me a hotpocket

Certain people (like me lol) naturally want [expletive] when it first comes out so you're right in that aspect. But at some point (as an adult anyway) you realize: "This is too expensive"

I haven't payed 60 dollars for any of my PS3 games. My wife got me FF13-2 when it first came out as a birthday gift but I got Infamous/Lil Big Planet for free, paid $6 or $9 for a few games off the PSN, didn't pay full for Madden and I ended up trading that in towards credit for Tekken Tag 2.

It's good marketing I guess; it's ingrained in people

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#24 PhillyLaker24

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Posted September 17, 2012 - 03:19 PM

That's just the first wave imo. Even I would have paid the price tag when the PS3 first came out. But for 700/800, mutha[expletive]a better be able to cook me a hotpocket

Certain people (like me lol) naturally want [expletive] when it first comes out so you're right in that aspect. But at some point (as an adult anyway) you realize: "This is too expensive"

I haven't payed 60 dollars for any of my PS3 games. My wife got me FF13-2 when it first came out as a birthday gift but I got Infamous/Lil Big Planet for free, paid $6 or $9 for a few games off the PSN, didn't pay full for Madden and I ended up trading that in towards credit for Tekken Tag 2.

It's good marketing I guess; it's ingrained in people


Yea the reason these things come out so high priced because these companies know they have a loyal following and people will pay that top dollar for the system when it first comes out. Over time it drops and they make cheaper models so they can bring more people into their customer base and allow for their brand loyalty to grow. I mean when the xbox elite came out it was such a better deal than the original xbox, then the xbox s came out and that was even a better deal than the elite.

Im with you though Im not gonna be shelling out that type of money for any system. Being the first to have something may be cool, but I rather have the extra hundred bucks in my pocket.

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#25 pkflyers

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Posted September 17, 2012 - 04:30 PM

Naa I think it will definitely be more than that. The reason that I think the new consoles will be so much is because the gimmick stuff they added onto the 360 and ps3 I feel will be standard on the new things. For example I feel like kinect integration will be standard on the new xbox and with ps3 they will try to come up with something that is similar to this, hence play station move but well that was a pretty big fail.To me I think that the new systems are gonna be more than just gaming systems, but rather trying to be the center of you media system on top of playing games. Both 360 and ps3 already do good at this and Im sure both companies will find a way to improve on these things. Hardware upgrades is where the big bucks come in to. People thing since they see smart phones going for 200 bucks that things such as processioning power is cheap, but the real price that the carriers pay for the phone is around 700 and 800 bucks, us the consumer just save money when you sign a 2 year deal. Maybe 700 is a little steep but 600 seems more than likely to me if their gonna try to build a power house system that is gonna stay around for 10 years.



the thing is, the price to produce existing technology usually goes down over time

you mention the "gimmicky" stuff may come standard on these new systems, but i dont think adding those things as standard features would drive the price up that much

blu ray players were going at $1000 back in 2006, but they are nowhere near that price these days because technology has improved

i dont think the move or the kinect will be standard features in the new consoles though, the market isnt big enough to warrant adding those things as standard features

i say that because, lets be honest, the majority of people who buy consoles arent casual gamers, and those "gimmicky" features are catered to casuals (i.e the ppl that play games on their iphone/FB/etc)

nobody is going to buy a 700-800 dollar system, not even hardcore gamers would pay for that, that is unless those systems also has the ability to double as a computer (like the PS3 was able to do at launch)

sony really downgraded the ps3 ALOT to bring the prices down, it used to have many more cool features than what the new are able to do (installing a new OS, multiple e-reader ports, doubling as a portable heater, etc) which is limiting its life expectancy


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#26 pkflyers

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Posted September 17, 2012 - 04:42 PM

The same thing was said when the consoles came out for hundreds of bucks and games cost 60 dollars. But games still cost 60 bucks and both consoles still sold out even with their huge price tags as soon as they came out. People go out and buy it anyway to be the first ones to have it. To me 60 bucks for a game is crazy and I never really buy a game at full price unless I know I will play it for hundreds of hours. However, they still go for that much and people still buy them at full price, hell some people pay 80 bucks for stupid special editions. Do not underestimate how much the average consumer is willing to pay for something just because it is new or the simple fact they just want it. Look at the iphone 5, has sold out already and sold more than any other iphone in history after being announced, even though out of all the models it probably has the least amount of changes to it from the previous model.

you cant really compare the sales a phone to a game console though

a phone can travel with you at all times, can double as a GPS, mobile internet browser, radio, etc, it as multiple uses for someone on the move and basically has a higher value to a person than what a gaming console would, so the fact that people buy them regardless of the price is not surprising

a console being overpriced tho? people arent going to stand for that unless it does some crazy good [expletive]

and games are so much $$ these days because it costs alot more money to produce them than it did 10-15 years ago


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#27 PhillyLaker24

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Posted September 17, 2012 - 04:45 PM

the thing is, the price to produce existing technology usually goes down over time

you mention the "gimmicky" stuff may come standard on these new systems, but i dont think adding those things as standard features would drive the price up that much

blu ray players were going at $1000 back in 2006, but they are nowhere near that price these days because technology has improved

i dont think the move or the kinect will be standard features in the new consoles though, the market isnt big enough to warrant adding those things as standard features

i say that because, lets be honest, the majority of people who buy consoles arent casual gamers, and those "gimmicky" features are catered to casuals (i.e the ppl that play games on their iphone/FB/etc)

nobody is going to buy a 700-800 dollar system, not even hardcore gamers would pay for that, that is unless those systems also has the ability to double as a computer (like the PS3 was able to do at launch)

sony really downgraded the ps3 ALOT to bring the prices down, it used to have many more cool features than what the new are able to do (installing a new OS, multiple e-reader ports, doubling as a portable heater, etc) which is limiting its life expectancy


Thats the thing these new systems arent gonna be using existing cheap tech, their gonna try to make high powered machines that can go after those computer gamers. Computer gaming has really suffered due to the 360 and ps3, while price has some to do with it as well. The only knock on consoles is that they cant make a game look as beautiful or run as nice on comps.

You mention those prices for casual gamers, but like I said when they put those high prices out there its not to get the casual they dont have enough systems out there to sell to both the casual ones and the hard core fans anyway. Those high prices are for the loyal fans of the system and they will buy them, both the 360 and ps3 were sold out for months even with their super high price tag when they first came out.

Edited by PhillyLaker24, September 17, 2012 - 04:46 PM.

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#28 PhillyLaker24

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Posted September 17, 2012 - 04:50 PM

you cant really compare the sales a phone to a game console though

a phone can travel with you at all times, can double as a GPS, mobile internet browser, radio, etc, it as multiple uses for someone on the move and basically has a higher value to a person than what a gaming console would, so the fact that people buy them regardless of the price is not surprising

a console being overpriced tho? people arent going to stand for that unless it does some crazy good [expletive]

and games are so much $$ these days because it costs alot more money to produce them than it did 10-15 years ago


Games are so much money because people have shown they will pay that much for a game. Developing a game does take a lot of money, but going by your assumption why did they used to release some games like nfl2k5 for 25 bucks when other games were going for double that? The game companies make a profit either way, of course its in every business advantage to charge more for their product. Games are 60 bucks because consumers have shown they will pay that much for them not because game companies need to charge that much to make a profit.

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#29 pkflyers

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Posted September 17, 2012 - 05:06 PM

Games are so much money because people have shown they will pay that much for a game. Developing a game does take a lot of money, but going by your assumption why did they used to release some games like nfl2k5 for 25 bucks when other games were going for double that? The game companies make a profit either way, of course its in every business advantage to charge more for their product. Games are 60 bucks because consumers have shown they will pay that much for them not because game companies need to charge that much to make a profit.

i dont want to get into the economic side of things, but nfl2k5 was so cheap because they were going up against madden, which has a huge following.. one of the easiest ways to get fast customer support is to produce a great product cheaper than what your competitors are charging, so basically thats what they the ppl at 2k were doing, they wanted to get a customer following

in terms of the game pricing tho, what you are saying is true, but only to a certain extent..game companies do not make a profit regardless of the price of a game, just look at Team Bondi (the ppl who developed the game LA NOIR) they recently went out of business in 2011 despite creating a successful game (which was priced at $60)

these games really could be priced MORE than $60 if game companies wanted to, but they know that if they did charge too much, nobody would buy them, but they cant charge them too low or else they will go bankrupt


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#30 pkflyers

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Posted September 17, 2012 - 05:20 PM

You mention those prices for casual gamers, but like I said when they put those high prices out there its not to get the casual they dont have enough systems out there to sell to both the casual ones and the hard core fans anyway. Those high prices are for the loyal fans of the system and they will buy them, both the 360 and ps3 were sold out for months even with their super high price tag when they first came out.

people will buy them, but it depends on the price


the 360 price at launch (not the core system) was $399

the ps3 price at launch (not the basic system) was $599

^ this is the reason the ps3 got off to such a bad start

when the ps3 first came out, at one point the ps2 was still outselling it in terms of the total number of units being sold

so everything depends on how much the price is for these new consoles


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#31 PhillyLaker24

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Posted September 17, 2012 - 05:23 PM

I know 2k didn't have the following but you can't believe they still were making profit they weren't putting out a game to just lose money.

Game companies know that they can charge 60 bucks for a game and still sell a lot. Your telling me that devolping a game for the pc, 360 , and ps3 all cost the same ? That's why its 60 bucks when ever a big title comes out on them. No its 60 bucks because they know right now that is the markets price for buying a game. The game companies reservation price is much lower than that but they know people will pay up to 60 bucks for a game.

Game companies arent doing as well not for the fact that games cost too much to make its because the gaming industry as a whole is down. This is why a new system is on the way from Sony and Microsoft to shoot the market up with a new product and hopefully make things turn around. Cost for making a game is a lot but 60 bucks is not what it takes to cover cost and make a profit. Especially for big name games.

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#32 pkflyers

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Posted September 17, 2012 - 05:36 PM

I know 2k didn't have the following but you can't believe they still were making profit they weren't putting out a game to just lose money.

Game companies know that they can charge 60 bucks for a game and still sell a lot. Your telling me that devolping a game for the pc, 360 , and ps3 all cost the same ? That's why its 60 bucks when ever a big title comes out on them. No its 60 bucks because they know right now that is the markets price for buying a game. The game companies reservation price is much lower than that but they know people will pay up to 60 bucks for a game.

i know all games dont cost the same to make, but i think they charge them at $60 regardless is so they make a profit (duh lol)

what if a company spends alot of money to produce a game, but then it flops?

^ they lose money

but then they have game that cost less to produce, but its successful

^ do u think the game companies are going to charge people less for the game just because it cost them less to produce it? hell no, they still have to cover their ass because they lost money from the game that flopped

so thats what i think goes on alot these days, not every game is successful, so in the end, these companies are losing money, so they charge people $60 regardless to make a profit (duh)

Game companies arent doing as well not for the fact that games cost too much to make its because the gaming industry as a whole is down. This is why a new system is on the way from Sony and Microsoft to shoot the market up with a new product and hopefully make things turn around. Cost for making a game is a lot but 60 bucks is not what it takes to cover cost and make a profit. Especially for big name games.


how does having a new system solve anything? i think the recession has more to do with it than anything

Edited by pkflyers, September 17, 2012 - 05:42 PM.


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#33 PhillyLaker24

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Posted September 17, 2012 - 06:01 PM

Yea I know why they are charging 60 bucks but the first 360 game to come out was 60 dollars not because they were like oh man we have to cover cost and make profit, no they saw that systems went up in price and now could justify a higher price for their games. Your saying that they make games 60 bucks to cover cost and their company's ass I'm saying their doing it because the consumer has shown we will pay that much lol. They would still make a hefty profit selling a game at 45 bucks but its at 60 because the market shows that is where the game companies can still sell millions while maximizing their profits. How much it cost to produce a game is a very small part of how much they charge for it, it has to do with the fact consumers are willing to pay that much.

Also the gaming industry saw a huge growth when ps3, 360, and the Wii came out. That is what a new system will do product cycles normally last as long as they are making a lot of money, but once a decline is shown and profit is no longer maximized that is when a new product is needed and produced. Why else would they make a new product in the first place? Money and growth is what the new systems will do for the gaming sector because right now it is declining .

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#34 pkflyers

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Posted September 17, 2012 - 07:30 PM

Yea I know why they are charging 60 bucks but the first 360 game to come out was 60 dollars not because they were like oh man we have to cover cost and make profit, no they saw that systems went up in price and now could justify a higher price for their games. Your saying that they make games 60 bucks to cover cost and their company's ass I'm saying their doing it because the consumer has shown we will pay that much lol. They would still make a hefty profit selling a game at 45 bucks but its at 60 because the market shows that is where the game companies can still sell millions while maximizing their profits. How much it cost to produce a game is a very small part of how much they charge for it, it has to do with the fact consumers are willing to pay that much.

Also the gaming industry saw a huge growth when ps3, 360, and the Wii came out. That is what a new system will do product cycles normally last as long as they are making a lot of money, but once a decline is shown and profit is no longer maximized that is when a new product is needed and produced. Why else would they make a new product in the first place? Money and growth is what the new systems will do for the gaming sector because right now it is declining .

how would game companies still make a profit selling games at $45 despite the fact that it cost more money to produce games today than it did last generation?

new games last generation were cheaper to produce than this generation and cost $49 apiece new

your telling me that game companies would still make a profit this generation charging LESS money than what new games cost last generation?

I'm saying their doing it because the consumer has shown we will pay that much lol


^ overall i agree with what your saying, but you are only looking at it from the customers standpoint, its a 2 sided street

companies cant charge games too low, or else they will go out of business, but they cant charge too high or else nobody will buy the game, soi think $60 is the median price where they can still make a profit and not risk going out of business


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#35 PhillyLaker24

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Posted September 17, 2012 - 08:32 PM

how would game companies still make a profit selling games at $45 despite the fact that it cost more money to produce games today than it did last generation?

new games last generation were cheaper to produce than this generation and cost $49 apiece new

your telling me that game companies would still make a profit this generation charging LESS money than what new games cost last generation?



^ overall i agree with what your saying, but you are only looking at it from the customers standpoint, its a 2 sided street

companies cant charge games too low, or else they will go out of business, but they cant charge too high or else nobody will buy the game, soi think $60 is the median price where they can still make a profit and not risk going out of business


Thats the thing you think that they were charging 49 bucks because thats how much it was to cover cost and still make a profit, Im saying that they were charging 50 because thats all the market was willing to pay. It changed when the new systems came out because well the cost of the systems went up and of course game development went up, but they saw that the market was now willing to pay more.

I hate to break it to you but if you think that the 60 dollar price tag on a video game is what is keeping a company from going out of business you are surely mistaken. Yes I know that these companies must make a profit, but this is America where supply and demand are in place. Unless there is a price ceiling or price basement put into place on video games you can guarantee that these games are not near their reservation price ( or the point to where companies would no longer makes games because they arent profitable.)

I feel like we are almost going in circles now lol. I just think to say that there is no way that there are so many companies that are in this business that are solely relying on the 60 dollar price tag to stay in business is wrong. Things being sold for profit for pennies on the dollar only happen during liquidation of a company or something along those lines never in the free market. Companies dont enter a business sector knowing that it is that close to failure due to the price just making a game profitable. Games would still be profitable if their price has a big price reduction, of course it wouldnt be as big a profit and would lead to many companies calling it quits because the risk out weighs the reward that is common sense. However, you best believe that 60 bucks for a game is wayy more than what it takes for the gaming company to make a nice chunk of change on a game.

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#36 bigfetz

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Posted September 17, 2012 - 09:08 PM

The only real reason one has to upgrade is compatibility. Compatibility tends to happen after a few year. Mainly with computers is the problem. If you have a computer that is 2-3 years old you will find its not able to do things that modern computers can do or at least not nearly as fast. If your doing simple things like using word or simple things like that you dont need to upgrade for years. I laugh at people who get these super expensive computers and use them for word and the internets.

I have to use almost every aspect of my computer on my macbook pro. It works great for me but in a year or two I will be in trouble because newer updates will not work to well with these computers.

You can say well the companies are doing that on purpose to make you buy them but not really. When greater technoligy is made better hardware is needed.

An average computer 5 years ago would crash every once in a while just trying to use things like games and sometimes simple things like word.

Hell by the year 2020 it is projected by moores law that microchip performance will almost plateau completely due to reaching the atomic level of size. So that means people will most likely be seeing new types of computers and we will be looking at computers these days as something like the old vacume tube days.

This means that everyone will have to upgrade or else nothing will be compatible. People may look at all these upgrade by companies as a small increment but here something that might interest you.

Posted Image

Every year or so it doubles. Been going like that for 40+ years.

Basically my point is. Yea dont upgrade every 6 months when any new thing comes out wait about a year. But any longer and you will see a drastic difference in what you have and whats being made now. Things will start loosing compatibility and programs will crash more often.

just my :2cents: lol

#37 pkflyers

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Posted September 17, 2012 - 09:09 PM

Thats the thing you think that they were charging 49 bucks because thats how much it was to cover cost and still make a profit, Im saying that they were charging 50 because thats all the market was willing to pay. It changed when the new systems came out because well the cost of the systems went up and of course game development went up, but they saw that the market was now willing to pay more.

I hate to break it to you but if you think that the 60 dollar price tag on a video game is what is keeping a company from going out of business you are surely mistaken. Yes I know that these companies must make a profit, but this is America where supply and demand are in place. Unless there is a price ceiling or price basement put into place on video games you can guarantee that these games are not near their reservation price ( or the point to where companies would no longer makes games because they arent profitable.)

I feel like we are almost going in circles now lol. I just think to say that there is no way that there are so many companies that are in this business that are solely relying on the 60 dollar price tag to stay in business is wrong. Things being sold for profit for pennies on the dollar only happen during liquidation of a company or something along those lines never in the free market. Companies dont enter a business sector knowing that it is that close to failure due to the price just making a game profitable. Games would still be profitable if their price has a big price reduction, of course it wouldnt be as big a profit and would lead to many companies calling it quits because the risk out weighs the reward that is common sense. However, you best believe that 60 bucks for a game is wayy more than what it takes for the gaming company to make a nice chunk of change on a game.

the bolded part is basically what im trying to say

i think $60 is the median price where its enough money for a company to make a profit, and its also the maximum customers are willing to pay w/o causing a revolt

just look at what nintendo is doing with the wii,

new wii games usually cost $50, but their new system (wii U) those games will be costing $60

why doesnt nintendo just charge $50 like the previous wii games?

the answer is, because ya thats how much people are willing to spend for games, but they also have to take into consideration the new cost of production, and thats basically what im trying to say..these companies have to cover their production costs first and foremost, THEN they can worry about supply and demand

Edited by pkflyers, September 17, 2012 - 09:13 PM.


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#38 24allday

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Posted September 17, 2012 - 09:12 PM

Just got the galaxy s3 today, diggin it so far but even with a 2 yr upgrade this bad boy cost $300. Better than my previous blackberry though, plan on sticking to this for a long time

#39 NYCLakerfan

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Posted September 17, 2012 - 09:24 PM

This is one of the main reasons I'm not a big tech person, I see a lot of ppl always feeling the need to get the newest phone or whatever but like whats the real point you just want it because it's new, unless it actually has some great revolutionary or innovative features.

And then you actually do get whatever it is it's like phone and its fun for a few days or weeks and then what? You just get used to it and means little so there was no point in getting so worked up for it in the first place.

Edited by NYCLakerfan, September 17, 2012 - 09:25 PM.


#40 PhillyLaker24

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Posted September 17, 2012 - 09:31 PM

the bolded part is basically what im trying to say

i think $60 is the median price where its enough money for a company to make a profit, and its also the maximum customers are willing to pay w/o causing a revolt

just look at what nintendo is doing with the wii,

new wii games usually cost $50, but their new system (wii U) those games will be costing $60

why doesnt nintendo just charge $50 like the previous wii games?

the answer is, because ya thats how much people are willing to spend for games, but they also have to take into consideration the new cost of production, and thats basically what im trying to say..these companies have to cover their production costs first and foremost, THEN they can worry about supply and demand


Supply and demand is what they look at first not the other way around. If the market shows that it is a surplus and that has a good profitability then they enter it and make a game. They dont make a game and then say hey we need to sell each of these for 60 bucks to make good money.

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