88 replies to this topic

[lakerfool]

Hypothetical question

Lets say you're an engineer with great potential for discovery

You're currently with the company making your beginning salary of 50K a year

But on the free market 5 corporations want to pay you 300K a year

Your current company wants to lowball you 200K a year

Their claim is that 'they trained you, and gave you the tools to become who you are'

Yet you're the one bringing them millions in revenue

Do you stay with your current company because of 'loyalty', or do you go to one of the companies paying you much more and who appreciate your value?

ALSO

Do you get mad at your agent for trying to get you 300K at your current company so you can stay?

[JD]

Hypothetical question

Lets say you're an engineer with great potential for discovery

You're currently with the company making your beginning salary of 50K a year

But on the free market 5 corporations want to pay you 300K a year

Your current company wants to lowball you 200K a year

Their claim is that 'they trained you, and gave you the tools to become who you are'

Yet you're the one bringing them millions in revenue

Do you stay with your current company because of 'loyalty', or do you go to one of the companies paying you much more and who appreciate your value?

ALSO

Do you get mad at your agent for trying to get you 300K at your current company so you can stay?

Your analogy is seriously flawed.

A) Bynum is under contract.
B) The Lakers can pay him more than any other team can.

So to make your analogy a better one.

You're an engineer with great potential. You signed an exclusive contract to work for a company, based on your potential and limited to what the market can offer you.

You're involved in a car accident and are in a coma for several months. When you come out of it, you have limited brain capacity. The doctors say you should recover fully, but to date, you're still not on top of your game.

You're able to renegotiate your contract at this time and are asking for the max, though you still have time left on the current one and you're still not performing at 100%.

No company on the face of this planet is going to give you that contract, until they're sure you're going to bring the results, your potential showed.

[lakerfool]

Your analogy is seriously flawed.

A) Bynum is under contract.
B) The Lakers can pay him more than any other team can.

So to make your analogy a better one.

You're an engineer with great potential. You signed an exclusive contract to work for a company, based on your potential and limited to what the market can offer you.

You're involved in a car accident and are in a coma for several months. When you come out of it, you have limited brain capacity. The doctors say you should recover fully, but to date, you're still not on top of your game.

You're able to renegotiate your contract at this time and are asking for the max, though you still have time left on the current one and you're still not performing at 100%.

No company on the face of this planet is going to give you that contract, until they're sure you're going to bring the results, your potential showed.

Except you completely neglect the fact that on the free market, he will get max. NBA teams in the past have risked giving injured players contracts. NBA teams in the present will risk giving injured players contracts. Especially if those players are 21 year old centers with great potential.

Face it, we don't negotiate, he goes to New Jersey to play with LeBron. Buss needs to stop being a cheap skate. His cheapness prevented us from 4 or even 5peating.

[lakerswiz]

We gave him Kareem.

[ReaListik]

It's in the Lakers best interest to give Bynum the money that he deserves, because that leaves more money to be free to spend on other players, otherwise you're going to get yourself into financial trouble down the road.

If Bynum's not playing up to the standards of what constitutes a max contract then don't give him the money. That's the most important key to successful business, you only give employees what they deserve.

Edited by ReaListik, October 19, 2008 - 09:18 PM.

[JD]

Except you completely neglect the fact that on the free market, he will get max. NBA teams in the past have risked giving injured players contracts. NBA teams in the present will risk giving injured players contracts. Especially if those players are 21 year old centers with great potential.

Face it, we don't negotiate, he goes to New Jersey to play with LeBron. Buss needs to stop being a cheap skate. His cheapness prevented us from 4 or even 5peating.

No, I don't neglect what he will get on the free market. What you're neglecting is that the free market can't touch him right now. Doesn't matter what they can give him down the road... they can't give him jack right now.

Buss hasn't ever been a cheapskate with impact players, so to claim he's being one now, is ridiculous. Also is your claim, that it cost the Lakers a chance at 4 or 5-peating. He offered Snaq more money than anyone else, even after the writing was on the wall that Snaq was an unmotivated big turd. Snaq's childish antics (including cursing Buss during a pre-season game) and trade demands got his butt dealt. Funny, that he also ended up having to take LESS money on the contract he ended up getting.

Bynum proves he's healthy and continues what he was building on. He'll get his contract. New Jersey is a non-issue. Bynum will get his contract, if he shows last year wasn't a one and done. If you're so enamored with him and believe he is destined to return to that, then what are you worried about? If he doesn't and can't... then you should be hoping and praying the Lakers don't give him that max money... because then we're really screwed, holding onto damaged goods. Then you'll be one of the ones trashing Buss for giving him all that cash.

Make sure you're understanding that... if you're so positive Andrew is well on his way to recovery and dominance... then rest assured he'll get his payday from the Lakers. Its why I don't let it bother me (other than letting his mouthpieces run rampant). If its all about money, then he's not going to leave money on the table by going someplace else, that can't offer him as much.

[last stand 2.0]

Except you completely neglect the fact that on the free market, he will get max. NBA teams in the past have risked giving injured players contracts. NBA teams in the present will risk giving injured players contracts. Especially if those players are 21 year old centers with great potential.

Face it, we don't negotiate, he goes to New Jersey to play with LeBron. Buss needs to stop being a cheap skate. His cheapness prevented us from 4 or even 5peating.

what is it with you and the new jersey thing you can't just run out and sign lebron and andrew to max contracts

its laughable that that is the basis of your arguement

is it a scare tactic?

oh bynums going to play with the hated lebron oooooh aaaaaah i mean what exactly are you trying to accomplish with that completely false and well straight up imaginary scenario

[last stand 2.0]

there are many falsities in this thread right now

JD while you have generally made pretty smart and compelling arguements in this thread one arguement was false and that was the one about andrew not performing so far in the preseason he hasn't played basketball since january and has been mobile and improved every game

Lakerfool that new jersey thing is laughable it brings your entire arguement down trying to scare everyone by saying that andrew is going to go play with the apparent villain in lebron instead of kobe is a cheap scare tactic that is simply making your arguement cheesy and ineffective

now those saying bynum doesn't deserve it are wrong he is a legitimate post player with legitimate post moves who can flat out dominate the painted area and plays tough post defense and is an elite shotblocker. not to mention he is 20 years old. those dont come around but every 10 years even dwight howard at 22 years old is not half the offensive force in the post bynum is.

i say this truthfully and emphatically if bynum was the focal point of an offense he would be a legitimate 20ppg 11rpg 3apg 3bpg guy

but what david lee said was so wrong because phil did not slow bynum down he made bynum if he would have thrown bynum into the fire chances are at 18 years old he could have been discouraged and beaten down physically. bynum was not kobe or more adequate lebron he was more jermaine o'neal he was by no means NBA ready he was fat, slow, and unskilled and for david lee to say phil should have played him was well stupid.

for those saying we should give him the money based on boguts contract are completely oblivious to business. yes you do base contracts off of the market but to simply say well he gets a contract because this guy got a contract is not smart. the lakers have to evaluate his progress and if by mid november he looks tto be dominating january 08 style than you show him the money.

those bashing bynum need to stop bynum knows the window to make his money is short he could go out october 28th and shatter every bone in his leg or tear every ligament in his knee. when you have an oppurtunity to get money you take it. kobe will do the same this offseason these guys are not in debt to us fans.

we do not pay them we do not do anything to make sure their lives and their families lives are secure financially so don't go around with a sense of entitlement because you just look ingnorant.

[Beethovenite]

this is some HILARIOUS thread!

The best part is that Bynum WILL return to the Lakers whether we like it or not. Personally I like it. I really don't think he's going ANYWHERE.

So for us to be arguing about whether we'll lose him or not is rather silly.

The Lakers know what they're doing. We've had our share of big men and dealing with their agents.

I think Mitch is doing the right thing. Andrew will play well and he'll get his money.

Meanwhile I will continue enjoying reading your engineer analogies.

[lakerfool]

what is it with you and the new jersey thing you can't just run out and sign lebron and andrew to max contracts

its laughable that that is the basis of your arguement

is it a scare tactic?

oh bynums going to play with the hated lebron oooooh aaaaaah i mean what exactly are you trying to accomplish with that completely false and well straight up imaginary scenario

Hated LeBron? Who hates LeBron? Only Kobe jockers hate LeBron. LeBron is one of the most popular players in the NBA.

You don't find it possible that LeBron can get starting 18 million a year while Bynum would get a starting 13 million a year?

Quit being foolish. I'm giving you an example. If not NJ, there will always be a team with money to spend.

[lakerfool]

No, I don't neglect what he will get on the free market. What you're neglecting is that the free market can't touch him right now. Doesn't matter what they can give him down the road... they can't give him jack right now.

Buss hasn't ever been a cheapskate with impact players, so to claim he's being one now, is ridiculous. Also is your claim, that it cost the Lakers a chance at 4 or 5-peating. He offered Snaq more money than anyone else, even after the writing was on the wall that Snaq was an unmotivated big turd. Snaq's childish antics (including cursing Buss during a pre-season game) and trade demands got his butt dealt. Funny, that he also ended up having to take LESS money on the contract he ended up getting.

Bynum proves he's healthy and continues what he was building on. He'll get his contract. New Jersey is a non-issue. Bynum will get his contract, if he shows last year wasn't a one and done. If you're so enamored with him and believe he is destined to return to that, then what are you worried about? If he doesn't and can't... then you should be hoping and praying the Lakers don't give him that max money... because then we're really screwed, holding onto damaged goods. Then you'll be one of the ones trashing Buss for giving him all that cash.

Make sure you're understanding that... if you're so positive Andrew is well on his way to recovery and dominance... then rest assured he'll get his payday from the Lakers. Its why I don't let it bother me (other than letting his mouthpieces run rampant). If its all about money, then he's not going to leave money on the table by going someplace else, that can't offer him as much.

Buss has been extremely cheap as of late.

I can easily see him saying 'I don't want to give this guy max. We got to the finales with Kobe/Gasol/Odom. I'll take my chances'.

To me, it is clearly heading in that direction. The same direction that shunned him from signing a big third option we needed to 4/5 peat.

[BadScooter]

Bynum will be re-signed. He's not stupid and neither are the Lakers. This is manufactured drama, even more imaginary than Kobe getting traded.

/thread

[Savory Griddles]

His agent (David Lee) has only 3 clients: Bynum, Ariza and Hassan Adams. Needless to say, he needs Bynum to not only make a good deal of money for himself, but to legitimize his career and attract other FA that see he got a client of his "the max." For Bynum, the difference between 60 and 88 million is 2.8 million dollars.

[last stand 2.0]

Hated LeBron? Who hates LeBron? Only Kobe jockers hate LeBron. LeBron is one of the most popular players in the NBA.

You don't find it possible that LeBron can get starting 18 million a year while Bynum would get a starting 13 million a year?

Quit being foolish. I'm giving you an example. If not NJ, there will always be a team with money to spend.

i was making fun of you because you not only put new jersey in there but you said to go play with lebron as if to say

i know laker fans hate lebron so i'll scare them by saying bynum will go to play with lebron

i love lebron but i was simply making fun of your useless example that was simply a cheesy scare tactic when the fact of the matter is andrew bynum will be a laker for the forseeable future

[Icker]

Trade him then if he is going to leave.

[Jonny]

Much ado about nothing. .

In all seriousness, Bynum has not returned to the form of 07-08 yet. we're not talking about stats here, he's just not back to full mobility yet, and its obvious when you watch him play. he's compensating for his lack of mobility on the offensive end by rushing his post moves slightly, and he still doesn't have the power/lift of last season to finish off the moves he's making.

not to say that he isn't improving, he's improved every single game this pre-season in terms of awareness and mobility. (his alley-oop reverse jam from last night was just sick)

word of caution for Lakers fans, via TLN's interview with Ryan from Hornets247

Ryan: Bynum averaged 13.1 points and 10.2 Rebounds over 35 games. There isn’t a team in the game who wouldn’t love to have a 20-year old player capable of that, especially in the limited minutes he was playing when he produced it. Still, there’s also no reason to declare someone a superstar before they’ve proven they are one. In Tyson Chandler’s first year with the Hornets, he averaged 15.2 points and 14.8 rebounds over 30 games in the middle of the season. It happens - but I’ve got to see it happen for longer.

Source

[kobynum]

bynum has shown us much more,he has shown the ability to effectively make plays on both ends for him and his teammates

[Jonny]

bynum has shown us much more,he has shown the ability to effectively make plays on both ends for him and his teammates

On offense yes, but on defense? he hasn't shown as much

not as much as last year . yet

remember, Tyson Chandler averaged 15/14 for 30 games at one point. . you wouldn't build a franchise around him though. .

I think the underlying thing that everyone can agree on is that Bynum, if he reproduces last season's form for an entire season, definitely deserves the max.

The lakers, wisely or unwisely (and this is where everyone begs to differ), want to wait and see if he can first, before offering the max.

[kobynum]

defensively he has got blocks and he has intimidated the hell outta guards from easy lay ups. The only thing he hasnt done that well was a couple of mistakes on defensive rotations, and not being the best at pick and roll lateral movement, but no one shuts out everyone. he's is a top 5 big man defender at the very least imo

[UKUGA]

In short, I do hope the Lakers sign Bynum to the max (or close enough to make his agent shut up) and then he flourishes.

In reality, I know that Bynum's best season-to-date was cut short due to injury, and it's not unreasonable for the Lakers to want to see how he holds up this year, before inking him to the long-term deal that I think that they probably do ultimately want to give him.

All that said, the Lakers do have Kobe, Pau, and LO's big contract. I think the Lakers brass does feel as if they have some flexibility, if they don't find Bynum worthy of a max deal, and he decides to leave.

Out of curiosity, would other teams trade young stars of their own for Bynum?

Would Portland trade Oden for Bynum? Oden is cheaper for longer, but Oden has a bigger injury history.

Would OKC trade Durant for Bynum? Small for big. Big for small. Salaries the same for now.


Is it possible that the Lakers will dangle Bynum for a younger up & comer in an attempt to give them a little more time to decide whether or not they are ready/willing/able to give the guy a max deal?