This season, watch the Clippers!!
Posted October 02, 2008 - 04:00 PM
orrrrrr, if they're on opposite coasts, you get the good old local double-header.
i think the majority of Lakers fans don't hate the Clipps... mainly because there hasn't been much heat in the rivalry... sans 2006.
they have a new look, and it's definitely going to be fun to watch.
Posted October 02, 2008 - 05:41 PM
1) You're team is plagued with injury prone stars, you're best player in Baron played his 1st 70+ game season SINCE 2002, same goes with Camby, he's only played 3 total 70+ games in his 15 year career and last year was one of them. Even Kaman is getting progressivly worse in the played games department, maybe that can change this year, maybe, the reliable players are Mobley and Ricky Davis, but even Tim Thomas is injury prone.
2) Don't exaggerate with Kaman, he IS NOT the 3rd best rebounder in the league nor is he the 3rd best shotblocker in the league because in actuality you have to play in 85% of team games to be considered but he only played 56 games last year, I can agree percentage-wise he is supposedly better than the likes of Tim Duncan, Al Jefferson, or Tyson Chandler in rebounds but those guys played 78+ games each, same type of scenario for blocks as well, all of the top 15 except Yao played 76+ games. Don't get me wrong, he's good but not what you're making him out to be.
3) Every time Camby gets traded, the first year he's on that team, he plays like crap, all of his stats go down, maybe because he has to learn the system but it's the truth.
4) Al Thornton is a beast, but many 2nd year players go through slumps, we don't know if he will or not.
5) IMO, you have a decent bench filled with veteran type players, but will they fill out their roles such as ... will Mobley be okay with moving to the bench? Will Tim Thomas or Brian Skinner get enough playing time? Will all these players mesh together since this is basically a team with all new starters except Kaman? Can Camby shoot good enough to make space for Kaman, or can he get the blocks /rebounds he used to get since he's playing the PF position now? Can all these players gel together in such a short period of time? Who knows but these are all important questions about your team.
P.S. - As we all know youtube mixes should never be used to help people judge a player because even youtube can make Kwame Brown look like Kevin Garnett
Edited by phifedogg76, October 02, 2008 - 05:42 PM.
Posted October 02, 2008 - 08:58 PM
Btw L.A.K.E.R NICE SIGNATURE hahaha!
And good arguments Phife, but just to let you know about Kaman, he was unstoppable on the boards and blocking shots like crazy.. He wasn't slowing down a single bit. In my opinion the only reason he "got injured" was just like what Sam Cassell did.. He jumped ship, because it was just pretty much pointless to play.
But Kaman's always had that killer instinct. The only reason he slumped 2 years ago, which was supposed to be his breakout year, is because he got injured and missed the entire training camp. He was totally out of shape.
As for the injuries, let's knock on wood, but Baron Davis is in his BEST shape, I know a Clipper analyst who met with him and he said that Baron looks absolutely great compared to before. Staying fit helps reduce getting injured.
Edited by TheCalmInsanity, October 02, 2008 - 09:02 PM.
Respect me and I'll respect you. Don't respect me... we'll cross that bridge when we get there
Posted October 02, 2008 - 09:52 PM
Loss of Elton Brand? We never had him last year... In my opinion the 76ers took a HUGE gamble on him giving him a 5 year deal when it's unknown if he's back in shape yet, or anywhere near where he was. Even if he is, we still used his salary VERY well by getting good bench players and getting that "weak sauce depth" that you guys have mentioned I'm very happy with our depth. If we got Brand, we would just hire bench players to play for peanuts.
Another thing... Brand NEVER led the Clippers to the playoffs. The year we made it and were 1 game away from the Conference finals, it was Sam Cassell's leadership that took us there. It was his contract year so he played his [expletive] off to get that juicy contract. Of all of Brand's years he's failed to lead us anywhere. His stats were great and his heart was a nice thing to have on a team... He was a workhorse. But a winner? No...
I don't understand how you guys can put DENVER above the Clippers, when we just got their best defender. They had no defense to start with. Don't you remember kicking their asses? They just lost 2 of their bigs.
Portland is good.. But we don't know how good Oden is! Until we see him play in the NBA, it doesn't matter how much he dominated in college. Look at J.J Reddick.
Another thing, they're a very young team... I'll be bold and predict that they will be a championship team in the FUTURE, but as of right now I don't see it. There's no veteran leadership. Brandon Roy is also out for the first few months with surgery.
Phoenix? Laker fans laughed at Phoenix when they traded Marion for Shaq. Their defense got better but who knows how much beating Shaq can take at this age...
Dallas.. I'm a HUGE Jason Kidd fan but I honestly don't know how good these guys will be.
All these teams in the West, sure they were good last year. But- Doesn't mean they can't fall apart this year for any reason. That's the beauty of the NBA- you never know what will happen, you can't call any teams "elite". And you can't expect for last season to repeat itself. Especially because the East has grown much stronger this year. The only solid teams I can see this year from the West is the Lakers, Hornets, and Spurs. The Rockets, McGrady or Yao are ALWAYS injured. The Jazz are very inconsistent.. one year they do good the other year they're not so great anymore. We'll see how they end up.
Im very surprised that you're not worried about the Elton Brand loss. All I heard last year from Clipper fans was that if Elton Brand was in the lineup the year would be different.
Yes I remember beating the Nuggets. BUT that was the Lakers. Not the Clippers. The Nuggets still have a very potent offense. They did average 110 points last season. Will the Clippers have a good defense? We arent sure. But they will be battling Denver for that 8th seed.
Clippers arent better then Portland. I'll just keep it as that, yes they are young but they have way more talent then the Clippers do.
The Suns still have Steve Nash, who is one of the top PG's in the game. Along with Amare, Raja and Barbosa coming off the bench, they will still give the Clippers problems.
Dallas will be up there. Jason Kidd cant even spell jump-shot anymore but with Dirk and Josh Howard they will still be tough to beat.
The one thing that Clipper fans have to understand is that just because you add a couple of players doesn't mean your team will have a drastic turnaround. It does not happen all the time. The Clippers could get lucky and improve right off the bat but you never know. Baron Davis said the following "It's going to be bumpy in the beginning."
I hope the Clippers do well. They are a Los Angeles team but I just dont see them being more then an 8 seed this year.
Posted October 03, 2008 - 12:09 AM
And another thing, a few players CAN make a drastic turnaround. Add defensive player of the year and top shot blocker in the league to an already potent Chris Kaman, that alone should show you good defense. Then there's on the ball defenders such as Baron Davis, Ricky Davis, Cat Mobley, and it's rumored that Al Thornton's defense improved immensely over the summer. Not to mention the expectations of Gordon's amazing defense, even though it hasn't been tested on the NBA yet.
They can score man. Clippers have scorers, they have defense, they have veterans, I'm actually very pleased. I don't see the Nuggets being anywhere close to last year. Honestly, their starting center is gone for nothing. The whole team is sulking right now, not to mention they're trying to pick up SMUSH PARKER for PG. Enough said, isn't it?! Denver has no point guard at all either.
The other arguments I can understand. I just think that when Clippers mesh they can have more talent. And I know the 13 game win streak from last year was impressive but you gota remember Portland was just a young team on a hot streak. They could be a bust this year, we never know. On that same note, so can the Clippers, but I'm just stating the obvious.
Respect me and I'll respect you. Don't respect me... we'll cross that bridge when we get there
Posted October 03, 2008 - 01:22 AM
Baron Davis - I'll doubt Davis quite a bit here. I think his big motivation in Golden State was being the guy who got them to the playoffs. Here in L.A. with his friends and family back beside him I think the distractions of his off-court business, etc. will prove his downfall. I like the guy, but I have a hard time seeing him looking out for the team as much as himself this year. He needs to be a point guard here and as good as Davs is at scoring, he's not a PG - he' a 2. He's a running system kind of guy playing with slow down players behind a coach who likes to grind things out. He won't be terrible, but I certainly do doubt him.
Jason Hart/Taylor - Potential is nice and all, but the Clippers have tried to live off the magical P word for years now. They need competent players, not 3rd rate backups, of which both these guys are.
Ricky Davis - Ricky Davis and Stephen Jackson are totally different guys. When Jackson was given his opportunities he stepped up. Davis has been given the same chances over and over again but only steps up when it involves his stats. Even then his version of stepping it up isn't too incredible. "Ricky Davis said he was going to start being mature.", I'll believe that when LeBron is a Laker. It simply won't happen, especially under Dunleavy discipline.
"Here are some Ricky Davis dunks" - dunks don't mean squat. History, attitude and team play do - none of which Davis has a good one of.
Cuttino Mobley - My favorite guy on the Clippers. The guy who didn't jump ship when things went sour (*cough* Sam Cassell *cough*). He's a decent defender, I don't think "awesome" has ever really been a word that's followed him around on either end of the court. "Sometimes ballhogs it or doesn't look to pass it to the post.", I fully agree, and that's what has always held him back. You'd hope he'd bring something new to the table very year, but he remains stagnant on both ends and like you said has real trouble sometimes seeing the court outside of a jumper. Big problem for your starting 2 when you actually have a big guy in the paint - big problem.
Eric Gordon - "All I can say is, POTENTIAL." Again, the Clippers can't afford to work off of potential in the West. In my opinion he was a horrible pick. He's too small to be a big time player at the 2 and doesn't have the ball skills to play the 1. He's a tweener size guy that I expect will have real trouble finding a groove. "Great 3 point shooter, shown flashes that he can drive in and take contact.", not on the NBA level he hasn't.
Al Thornton - Not necessarily amazing but certainly a bright spot for the Clippers. I do think this kid has the chops to blow up big time. The problem with him on the Clippers is is that he need to get more touches. Right now he's not and with Davis, Davis, Mobley, and Kaman on the court its going to be tougher to get those looks. But with all that said he is the one guy on the Clippers that should have a breakout kind of year. Maybe not 20+ a game, but he'll get his fair share of clean-up points.
Tim Thomas - A decent 3-point shooter - when open. Under tight coverage, mmm, not so much. Yet another guy on the Clippers who you hope has his mind straight, but odds are him and Ricky Davis will be best buddies come next summer - which isn't a good thing.
Steve Novak - He's a good addition but more for a team who only needed that one extra piece. It won't be easy for him to find consistent time on this clogged up team. In Houston he had a defined role, on the Clippers it'll be tougher to fish out where that role is. But if he can get the time, he'll be a decent little poor man's Steve Kerr type player.
Marcus Camby - The question here is which Camby do you get? The defensive player of the year Marcus or the disinterested Camby who mopes when things don't immediately go his way? I do agree that him moving to his natural 4 spot will be a big help for him. His blocks and rebounds though were produced from him playing out of position. Alongside a center like Kaman (as he's never played alongside a true 5) those numbers will dwindle. I don't think him learning how play with a center for the first time in his career this far along in it will be the quickest thing for him to learn. Again, he'll be decent, but I wouldn't hold my breath for the same output he had in Denver. A different role, a different team, and a different situation equals different play.
Paul Davis- Decent Chris Mihm kind of guy, but really - Paul Davis? I don't think the 3rd Davis on the team will amount to much more than an alright backup against certain teams.
Chris Kaman - Underrated? After last year he's simply rated. An enigma for sure - good when he wants to be and flat out non-existent when he wants to be too. He has to officially make up his mind what player he wants to be. With Brand on the court life was easy for him, but Brand and Camby are in two different leagues skills wise. I would expect he'd have a bounce back year, but expecting greatness as he learns how to play with an entirely new team (almost) may be overshooting it. He should be better than last year, but I'd leave it at that.
Brian Skinner - Not a center, but a fair backup 4. I expect Camby to shift to the 5 when Kaman steps off. "Great" shot blocker - no, decent presence in the paint (against second tier type players)? Yes. Skinner's a competent backup, but the Clippers are essentially thin on bulk/size up front.
DeAndre Jordan - "PURE POTENTIAL." There it is again the aforementioned P word. If he sees any minutes it'll be when the Clippers are getting blown out or vice versa. "But he's a Dwight Howard type player...", whoa, whoa - pump the brakes there. Jordan's as close to being on Howard's level as I am to Dennis Miller's. "He averaged 26 PPG and 16 rebounds and 8 blocks (yes blocks!) in high school.", you are aware that was high school right? This is the NBA major, giant enormous, massively different picture now.
When it comes down to it, I see this cobbled together team as Sterling telling the fans, "Yeah we lost Brand, but look, look we still have THESE other guys. Remember these guys, we'll be O.K. without Elton - please come to our games - please?"
In the ridiculous Western Conference the Clippers will be looking in on the playoff picture when it counts. I can totally see a good start, the fans going crazy, everyone lauding them as the second playoff team in L.A. and then reality will set in. There's too many mammoth egos on this team to placate them all. Dunleavy has his hands full. Dunleavy's a hardcore discipline kind of guy with a team full of guys who can be aloof to downright distracted at times - there will be problems.
I would assume Dunleavy will be fired after this year and Clipper fans will still be wondering what to do next now that THIS didn't work either. Plainly put, there won't be enough time in one season for Mike to figure out how to get this team rolling.
And by the way, if people want to post conflicting opinions (such as this one) as long as they're in good taste and don't take on a personal insult level - they're welcome to it.
Clippers finish 9th in the West.
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