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Bynum's pathetic rebounding


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#41 L.A.K.E.R

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Posted January 13, 2009 - 09:43 PM

:goodpost: (Both replies by last stand)

#42 lakerfool

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Posted January 13, 2009 - 09:54 PM

I don't understand, how hard is going after the ball? lol.

Btw did y'all see the way he outran Yao down the court and got a dunk? I don't remember Andrew hustling like that to get back on defense.

Outrunning Yao is not exactly an accomplishment. Yao's probably the slowest player in the league.
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#43 last stand 2.0

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Posted January 13, 2009 - 10:16 PM

Outrunning Yao is not exactly an accomplishment. Yao's probably the slowest player in the league.


wrong dikembe and curry have that title IMO
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#44 leor_77

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Posted January 13, 2009 - 11:21 PM

Bynum and Gasol BOTH need to step it up offensively. Kobe is having to do too much of the work, and that's not gonna get it done when it counts. Besides, you have two 7 - footers on the floor. I would expect much more on offensive rebounds, and mismatches have to be exploited to a max, as well.

#45 Nirvana

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Posted January 14, 2009 - 04:01 AM

Why attack DB? He pointed some facts and gets baited :rolleyes:


I hate when people play the "you're not the coach" or "I'm sure Kobe knows his game better than any of us fans do" card. Last time I checked this is a forum, which means it stays alive and active if people actually share thoughts. If your feelings get hurt from someone speaking truth then I guess that makes you a fake person.

Fake can't recognize real.


just because someone doesn't accept playing far beneath their potential does not make them any less a fan than anyone else. if anything, its the more die hard fans that truly know basketball that are willing to openly critique their team, and find room for improvement. the real fans do not want to be disappointed in june again, and we realize this lakers machine needs some fine tuning. being ok with barely winning regular season games against short handed teams (shorthanded yourself or not) is setting yourself up for failure when it truly counts. if you think we're going to win the championship playing like this, you're sadly mistaken.


Exactly, thanks.
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#46 netlord

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Posted January 14, 2009 - 04:11 AM

Well it's dissapointing, that's for sure, we were all pumped up in the preseason seeing Bynum bigger and stronger, like a rebounder machine, but this isn't being the case, he has to get his head into the game, and step up. We are going to need it to go far in the playoffs this year. He must have at least 10 reb a game min.
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#47 Kenrae

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Posted January 14, 2009 - 05:46 AM

i will say this bynum being here has lead to pau rebounding a lot more

i have noticed a lot of double box outs and a concerted effort to keep bynum off the glass therefore pau is grabbing more boards


That's something people don't usually take into account. I've seen that same "attack" on Pau when he was on Memphis, but if you took a closer look you could see that he was boxing out the opposing players so that a teammate could easily grab the rebound. Drew is doing the same with the Lakers and I'm sure it's Phil's idea. We have a tall PF, the best rebounding SG, and other good rebounders in Ariza and Odom. Drew is our biggest body in the paint but is slower than all those players, so the best strategy for the team is having him boxing out at least one player, two players if he's able, and let the others jump for the rebound.
Of course, that doesn't show on the statline... except for the fact that we're constantly outrebounding the other teams and winning games.
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#48 Nirvana

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Posted January 14, 2009 - 06:05 AM

That's something people don't usually take into account. I've seen that same "attack" on Pau when he was on Memphis, but if you took a closer look you could see that he was boxing out the opposing players so that a teammate could easily grab the rebound. Drew is doing the same with the Lakers and I'm sure it's Phil's idea. We have a tall PF, the best rebounding SG, and other good rebounders in Ariza and Odom. Drew is our biggest body in the paint but is slower than all those players, so the best strategy for the team is having him boxing out at least one player, two players if he's able, and let the others jump for the rebound.
Of course, that doesn't show on the statline... except for the fact that we're constantly outrebounding the other teams and winning games.


If Phil was going to have any player occupy a man or two, it would be Pau for the simple fact that Bynum is taller, bigger, stronger and can jump higher than Pau, and should therefore be the rebounding candidate.

The fact that Pau has to rebound to make up for Bynum's lack of determination means that Pau has to do more work instead of just being an offensive player.
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#49 blink-one

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Posted January 14, 2009 - 08:33 AM

I thought about maybe Bynum spend his effort guarding Ming, but I look at the box score and Yao had 17 rebounds!!!!!! I'm not sure whats going on. Our interior defense is awful! The beginning of the game they were just getting into the lane and scoring. I thought the lakers should of made an attempt to get Kwame back. He's not a great Offensive score, but his defense is far superior than Bynum and Gasol. This should be concerning. I also agreed that he got his extension too early and thus feeling a bit comfortable. I think we need to address this issue. Maybe having Bynum come off the bench? Starting lineup:fisher,kobe,rad,powell, and gasol? I love the effort that powell brings to the game and he has a decent 15 footer. What do you guys think?

#50 GCMD

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Posted January 14, 2009 - 09:32 AM

Amazing.

It took Bynum 2 years to develop that strong base he used to grab all of those rebounds last year. He injures his knee and loses about 8 months of playing time.

You really, REALLY expect him to gain all of that back in 4 months? Would be nice but that's a bit ambitious, don't you think?


I've already touched on the fact that Bynum and Pau are having spacing issues in the triangle.
I've already touched on the fact that Bynum and Pau are being used interchangeably, which is advantage:Pau.
I've already touched on the fact that Bynum's progression requires near max physical development.

Most importantly, I've touched on the fact that other teams are making a CONCERTED EFFORT to keep Bynum off the boards.


After reading all of that, if you are still 5-Alarm HOT over Bynum's play this year, have at it. We have to agree to disagree here.

#51 GCMD

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Posted January 14, 2009 - 09:36 AM

Don't forget all of the fouls he'd pick up forcing the rebounding issue.
And that we've been getting burned in transition defense so his first priority is getting back to defend.
And that we are LEADING THE LEAGUE in rebounding.


Yeah. All good things to consider also.

#52 pointguard11

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Posted January 14, 2009 - 09:49 AM

I thought about maybe Bynum spend his effort guarding Ming, but I look at the box score and Yao had 17 rebounds!!!!!! I'm not sure whats going on. Our interior defense is awful! The beginning of the game they were just getting into the lane and scoring. I thought the lakers should of made an attempt to get Kwame back. He's not a great Offensive score, but his defense is far superior than Bynum and Gasol. This should be concerning. I also agreed that he got his extension too early and thus feeling a bit comfortable. I think we need to address this issue. Maybe having Bynum come off the bench? Starting lineup:fisher,kobe,rad,powell, and gasol? I love the effort that powell brings to the game and he has a decent 15 footer. What do you guys think?


Most of those were only defensive rebounds and Yao only got 2. I believe those were when Pau was guarding him and Bynum was out. Yao played more minutes than Bynum. Another thing to consider is when guards get beat by their man and Bynum comes over to contest the shots then you can expect Bynum's man to be there for the rebound. Bynum's fault then? Nah it is the guards fault for allowing penetration.
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#53 pointguard11

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Posted January 14, 2009 - 10:07 AM

1. He's not even filled out his body yet. He can't do that in season. He needs an offseason to do that.

2. Playing beside Pau is new and has taken major adjustment for both. In Phil's system, he's switching them...but they don't have the same skillsets. Bynum does not equal Pau does not equal Bynum.

3. Money doesn't equal immediate results. They didn't pay him because he's a consistent AllStar player. They paid because he will BECOME a consistent AllStar player.



Most importantly, Bynum needs to concentrate on one thing this year - DEFENSE. He's out there trying to be a scorer in the paint and it's taking him away from the basket, away from rebounds, out of the play. When the rest of the league sends out a major memo to their post players to keep Bynum off the glass, 1 foot out of position is near IMPOSSIBLE to rebound from. Even when he's in position, I've seen them push him further under the basket or just keep a body on him to neutralize his elevation. He has plenty help "missing" those rebounds.

I'm not defending Bynum. I'm just not concerned yet. He's making strides on his post moves, fts, man-to-man defense and stamina. He's also getting up to game speed, slowly but surely. He needs this year to get comfortable and work on his body. He needs this year to get back to last year's form. If he's still putting up duds next year, I'll lead this "witch-hunt"....that's a promise.


Until then, IMHO, you're wasting your time with the in-depth analysis. THe name of the game is "progression". This is a marathon, not a sprint. Bynum has another 10 years left to wow you and your children. Sit back and enjoy.


Good post. Patience is needed lakernation. Growth for Bynum is not a straight line going up but a up and down line going up. Much like a stock price. Remember history. Many wanted to trade this guy even though he had a pretty good year his 2nd year in the league. His stock is going up and the fundamentals of his game and his potential is still very high. I would hold on to this stock and even invest more in it and like Al Pacino said to that school administration in the Scent of a Woman about the boy Charlie. "You hold this boy's future in your hands, committee! It's a valuable future. Believe me! Don't destroy it...protect it...embrace it. It's gonna make you proud one day...I promise you."
"The way Steve is as a teammate, the way he sets the tone, the way the team kind of takes on his persona. As a coach, that's the best thing in the world. It's easy to coach. He's taking care of the chemistry. You just coach."

Mike D'Antoni

#54 Scott P

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Posted January 14, 2009 - 12:31 PM

just because someone doesn't accept playing far beneath their potential does not make them any less a fan than anyone else. if anything, its the more die hard fans that truly know basketball that are willing to openly critique their team, and find room for improvement. the real fans do not want to be disappointed in june again, and we realize this lakers machine needs some fine tuning. being ok with barely winning regular season games against short handed teams (shorthanded yourself or not) is setting yourself up for failure when it truly counts. if you think we're going to win the championship playing like this, you're sadly mistaken.

What a whiny take. You know how lucky we are to have the Lakers? And don't talk to me about being a "die-hard fan". I've been a season ticket holder since 89. I've been there when Benoit Benjamin and Sam Bowie were their starting centers. When Sedale Threatt was their best player. To expect them to win every game and whine when they don't? To complain about a 21 year old who's just finding his way? Grow up. You're a "Faker" fan.

I hate when people play the "you're not the coach" or "I'm sure Kobe knows his game better than any of us fans do" card. Last time I checked this is a forum, which means it stays alive and active if people actually share thoughts. If your feelings get hurt from someone speaking truth then I guess that makes you a fake person.

Fake can't recognize real.

Tortured logic does not make a good argument. Another whiner heard from

#55 BadScooter

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Posted January 14, 2009 - 12:34 PM

31-6



Oh, I'm sorry, what are you b----es babbling about?

#56 LA Forever

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Posted January 14, 2009 - 12:39 PM

31-6

Oh, I'm sorry, what are you b----es babbling about?

Doesn't mean we can't fine tune little things. We are barely beating these lowly teams, but at least they won't be in the playoffs.

#57 BadScooter

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Posted January 14, 2009 - 12:41 PM

Doesn't mean we can't fine tune little things. We are barely beating these lowly teams, but at least they won't be in the playoffs.



I agree. But from the level of vitriol in this thread you'd think we were in big trouble. I don't mind nitpicking, but this [expletive] is ridiculous.


No wonder everyone hates us.

Edited by BadScooter, January 14, 2009 - 12:41 PM.


#58 Savory Griddles

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Posted January 14, 2009 - 12:42 PM

31-6



Oh, I'm sorry, what are you b----es babbling about?


Babbling about our center under performing which is causing us to BARELY get by teams we should be crushing. We barely beat Miami, Indiana and a injury decimated Houston. These should be 20 point blowouts. Rebounding is a hustle stat. Bynum isn't working hard and since we just signed him to a 14 million a year extension, he will be taking up significant luxury tax/salary cap space that could be used to resign players like Odom and Ariza. Its scary.

#59 Scott P

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Posted January 14, 2009 - 12:45 PM

Babbling about our center under performing which is causing us to BARELY get by teams we should be crushing. We barely beat Miami, Indiana and a injury decimated Houston. These should be 20 point blowouts. Rebounding is a hustle stat. Bynum isn't working hard and since we just signed him to a 14 million a year extension, he will be taking up significant luxury tax/salary cap space that could be used to resign players like Odom and Ariza. Its scary.

It's a long season. I say "we have the best record in the NBA". You'd say "But we've lost SIX GAMES". I'd say but we've won 31". You'd say "But many of them were close". OMG, another petulant Faker fan.

#60 Machinehead

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Posted January 14, 2009 - 12:50 PM

I just don't understand why barely beating bad teams is a big deal. Ya, we may not be perfect and not blowing out teams, but winning games is what it's all about. Plus, the players start to get used to crunch time and that "usual pressure" is just another day in the office.

I'd much rather be winning close games instead of everyone choking at the end of games because we are so used to blowing out teams.

But that's just my opinion....
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